Water, Water

Water, water, everywhere,
And all the boards did shrink;
Water, water, everywhere,
Nor any drop to drink.

Samuel Taylor Coleridge, The Rhyme of the Ancient Mariner

As of this writing, the Naugler family has lived on the Blessed Little Property for about two years, not counting the period when the children were in state care and Nicole and Joe were in a motel.

They had plans, of course.

old blog

Apart from the obvious distortions to the truth (they have a land contract on their property, not a conventional real estate mortgage with “in house” financing), we do learn here that there is a septic system, and either a well or a cistern on the property.

But all that needed assessment, and that costs money, and the Nauglers had no money, so they began hauling in water. In those ubiquitous white buckets.

Consider how much water that might be for a family of 13.

From the USGS website:

Estimates vary, but each person uses about 80-100 gallons of water per day.

Of course, this assumes that people are flushing toilets, and we know that’s not happening. And it also assumes bathing via a shower or tub, and I bet there’s precious little of that going on.  And when you have haul water, you get more frugal with it, so they would be inclined to use less for dishwashing and that sort of thing.

Still, I assume they haul in a whole hell of lot of water.

At the time she wrote this (from her old blog, post now gone so I cannot link), they were getting water from a local feed store.

Obviously, that created some problems, or they quit getting it there, or something, because they began looking for other sources.

Here’s Nicole’s synopsis.

few thoughts

We did outsource our water.

That made me laugh.  They “outsourced” it. In other words, they were scratching around trying to find water any place they could, preferably for free. They had several sources, she tells us. And they always offered to pay.

But mean people suck.

And some mean person whose initials are DR really sucks and told lies. And Nicole and Joe are “dealing with it privately at this time.”

There are really two stories here. Nicole is trying to sort of conflate them by totally ignoring the elephant in the room, and simultaneously trying to divert the whole issue to the very mean sucky DR.

I wondered about all this, so I did a bit of digging around. And here’s the basic time-table.

The incident with DR came first.  Here is what happened. DR and her family befriended the Nauglers for a while.  Ultimately, they had a bit of a falling out, nothing really horrible, but went their separate ways.

And one day, DR and her husband came home to find their water hose running.  It had obviously been running for hours.  Their neighbor told them that Joe and at least one of the boys had been at DR’s house earlier that day, while nobody was home, and got water.

Joe never called, never asked, and had no arrangement to get water from DR.  He just came when they were not home and took it. Furthermore, neither he nor Nicole ever called DR or her husband to say, “Gee, you know, we were in a bad place yesterday and needed water and you weren’t home and we just got some. I’ll be happy to come by and pay you for it. Didn’t know where  you were and I couldn’t ask and it was an emergency.”  Not one word.

In fact, until Nicole posted the above comment on February 8, 2016, neither of the Naugler adults had ever even admitted they came by and got water at all.  And DR has no idea how many times they’d done this in the past without bothering to ask or tell anyone.  The only reason she and her husband knew anything had happened on this occasion is because Joe left the water running to thank them.

I don’t know what planet Nicole lives on, but on the one I live on, that is stealing.  If Nicole and Joe are handling the issue “privately,” it’s really private indeed, since DR hasn’t a clue what she’s talking about.  I would suggest, Nicole, that DR and her husband deserve, at the very least, a sincere apology.

But that was maybe two years ago.

We have to fast-forward a little bit to the Joe Naugler Arrest Incident.

WAVE report

This is from the news report at the time (early May, 2015).

Now, I know that the media doesn’t get things right sometimes, and I’m willing to cut a little slack for that reason, but they are quoting the summons here.  Some reporter didn’t just make that up.

Joe went to the person’s house for water.  He was told no. He got pissed off and told his son to get the pistol out of the glove compartment.  (Lovely unschooling lesson, there, by the way.  What do you suppose the kid learned from that. . .)

And a little addition here:

cunt

From Nicole herself, we learn that he called the person a “cunt.”  That’s nice.  Another unschooling lesson, I see.  And yes, he threatened her, unless you think that “go get my gun out of the dash” is non-threatening.

Back to the original:

Subsequently, Joe tried to spin this incident into something else.  He insisted at one point that the disagreement was because he unfriended the person on Facebook. He also called the person a “meth head,” which is pure libel.

But there’s a larger point here.  He went there, not for tea and crumpets, but to get water.  He seems to have gone there before, but apparently wore out his welcome.

We had a guy come to our house once wanting to know if we had some hay he could buy to feed his livestock.  He just needed to get through, he said, until he could find some commercially, since it was night and the weekend.  We sold him a couple of square bales of hay.  We also gave him some ideas about where he might obtain some later on.

hay

It was fine. No problem at all.  He paid for the hay. We charged him exactly what it cost us.  It did mean that we now had two fewer bales than we did before, and in the end, that did prove problematic, but he needed them and we helped him out.

The problem was that a week later he was back wanting more hay.

We had become his hay supplier. And we knew why.  It was because we were selling him hay at the price we’d paid, the price the hay cost in the summer when it was plentiful.  Only this wasn’t summer.  This was winter and hay is expensive in winter.  He didn’t want to pay what the commercial feed store wanted for a bale of hay. Instead, he just wanted to use ours.

No matter that we’d had the foresight to buy ahead, that we’d gone to the trouble to hook up a trailer and go haul the stuff home, and then store it out of the weather.  He hadn’t bothered and he was just going to let us provide him with hay forever.

So we said, “No.”

This guy wasn’t Joe Naugler, so he said, “Oh, okay.  Sorry to have bothered you,” and left and I suppose got some hay some place else.  He didn’t start spreading rumors that we were mean sucky meth heads. He just left.

Nicole places great emphasis on the idea that they were offering to pay for the water.

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Mean damn people.  Joe was gonna pay for the water.

Well, the guy was perfectly happy to pay for the hay, too.  Only we said “no.”  We didn’t need to explain to him why we said no.  We just did. The hay was our hay and we didn’t want to sell it to him.  Period.

He was looking for a “good source” to buy hay, too.  Only we weren’t it.

What happened to “voluntaryism,” pray tell me?  And how exactly were you “looking for a business transaction” when you didn’t tell the person you got the water at all and you did it when they were not home?

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By “dependent” she means that they get city water or county water that they pay for.  Somehow she makes it sound like they are doing something in an inferior fashion to her “independence.”  Only last time I checked, Joe was the one running around begging people for water.

It’s true that 86% of Americans are on some sort of public water facility as a source for water.  Only about 15% of us have private wells, a fact that I found a little amazing, since we’ve had a well for nearly all my adult life, everywhere we’ve lived.

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Not half, Nicole.  86%.  She then veers right on to how since they had to buy the water, it’s only morally right that they then sell the water to the Nauglers at the same price they paid, just because Joe asked. (Only, as we’ve seen, he didn’t always ask.)

But even if he asked, and even if the person had an endless supply of water, and even if he paid, the person is not obligated to sell him water.  There are any number of reasons why someone might not want to do that.

Maybe they pay for their water by volume.  Maybe they don’t like looking at Joe.  Maybe they don’t think he’s pretty.  Maybe he smells bad. Maybe he’s an obnoxious prick.

Maybe they just don’t want him pulling up in their driveway without notice and helping himself, regardless of whether or not he pays them any money.

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They “chose” not to dig a well because they don’t have any money and can’t pay for it. They had the money (from the GoFundMe debacle), but “chose” not to use it to provide a water source for the Blessed Little Property.

They do not currently have a water source issue, probably because they get it from Nicole’s business.

Frankly, though, nobody really cares about that. What we care about is libel.  And Nicole has libeled DR.

sneed place

And we have this.  This is a photo which I have left relatively large, so you can see the thing in the red circle.

The photo is of the Naugler car (I suppose) with snow on it and a smiley face, but in the background, you see their next-door neighbors. You know, out in the “wilderness.”

The neighbors are the same ones who have a paved concrete driveway, multiple outbuildings and barns, an in-ground swimming pool, and a combine.

Here’s the commentary about it.

sneed place comments

Nicole, bless your blessed little heart.  You really don’t know anything about living in the country, do you?  Your neighbor is not hauling water because he has no well (or large cistern).  He’s got that “portable cistern” to haul water out to his fields so he can spray them with fertilizers, pesticides, herbicides, whatever.  Nearly every farmer who has fields of any size growing corn or soybeans or similar crops has one.

UPDATE:

Unlike Nicole, when I am wrong, I own it. And I was wrong about this. The next door neighbor does not, in fact, have a well and does, in fact, haul in water.  The tank is one of the sort that most people use to haul water to their fields as I mentioned.

However, I bet the neighbor doesn’t go to his neighbors to get water without telling them, and with no arrangements made, and I bet he doesn’t leave the water running.

But then came the most amazingly, incredibly asinine comments ever made in public.

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See how Nicole painted DR?  Sucky, mean woman who won’t just freely give water to these poor people with all these children who are in need. DR is “water greedy.”

Maybe DR just likes for people to fucking tell her when they are going to come to her property and help themselves.

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Where in the world does Nicole find these people?

73 thoughts on “Water, Water”

  1. Excellent Blog!

    I am the individual listed in some of these pictures. I live in this community and guess what? I have a well. In fact, all of my neighbors have wells. None of us haul water. There might be a very few that do continue to haul water, but I assure you it is the minority. I do not know if the Naugler’s next door neighbor has a well, but he runs a butcher shop and also has an in ground swimming pool. Butcher shops require quite a bit of water for clean up — and a swimming pool . . . well (no pun intended)

    The wells here can be problematic if not drilled properly. But it’s very overstated and it isn’t a good excuse. We have no sulphur, the water is delicious (we’re sitting on top of a limestone formation) and we’ve never had any issues. The well cost $3,600 about 12 years ago. Yes the water is “hard”, but a water softener takes care of that. As an added measure of safety, I installed a filtration system with a UV reverse osmosis system. Why? Because some neighbors don’t believe in respecting the aquifer. Some throw trash in sinkholes and some throw buckets of shit who knows where. We also have a 3000 gallon cistern that we collect rain water with. It’s just a backup and we use it to water the gardens and replenish ornamental ponds.

    Wells need power, but a generator will work if necessary. Some folks utilize cisterns to collect rain water and pressurize it with a pump. Again, this requires power. I’ve been advised that the Naugler’s property definitely had a cistern. No idea what kind of shape it’s in. Water need not be pressurized. There are various methods to recover it including hand pumps and – if you don’t mind the sound – a ram pump. I saw somewhere that they intend to give aquaponics a spin. A ram pump could move some water. But that’s the least of their concerns if they expect to enjoy any measure of success in aquaponics. Like most other things fed to the unknowing masses . . . it sells well and sounds good. It’s actually quite labor intensive and requires more than a dead pond.

    As far as getting the water situation under control; the best way to get on your feet is to get off your ass. If the cistern hasn’t been utilized after two years, if none of the money donated went to this most basic of priorities, I don’t see things changing.

  2. Nothing will ever change. Those poor kids. Playing in cold mud on Christmas and not having a big bathtub full of hot water to clean off in before bed.

    It’s a good thing Joe has 11 kids. Keeps him from ever actually having to pay the penalty for his actions.
    His actions will come back to haunt him.

  3. So far all they have done is to sit on their asses playing on facebook, make excuses about why this or that project failed. Of course, it is never their fault. I thank you for this blog because you make clear the real truth about the Nauglers as they continue to muddy the waters they have with shit and lies. I doubt anything will change. They will be forced off this land for one reason or another, not having figured out how to have an abundant water source being one of them. They don’t care enough to try. If they did care about water, two years and one successful go fund me campaign later, water would not still be an issue.

  4. Instead of aquaponics, maybe they could consider an Easter egg business.

    Here’s my thinking; they get that gaggle of roosters to the nearest vet, get gender reassignments done on all of them, then when the post op roosters start laying lots of eggs, they simply take them to the pond, dip them in the pond, and voila! Lots of green eggs.

    Kidding of course. But I admit that this venture is about as probable and feasible as any of the other grand plans.

    One excuse and deflection and spin after another.

  5. I thought the GoFundMe money was to improve the property. It would seem that instead it was used to purchase electronics for their off-the-grid family to use “for educational purposes” such as Face Book. (Paper books don’t require batteries or charging and can be very educational.)

    I can’t say that I’ve ever been in their situation, but I think if I had a windfall of cash as they did, I would use to to provide the basics before providing luxuries such as DSL cameras, iPhones and tablets. Now that I think of it, I don’t own any of those devices even though I have indoor plumbing and well paid employment. It’s all about priorities I guess.

  6. The thing that baffles me is not their lies or bullshit, it’s that anyone in their right mind would *believe* their lies and bullshit.

    There is no way in hell Nicole can groom enough animals to pay shop rent, water & electricity, insurance and supplies while simultaneously being the sole provider for feeding and clothing a family of 2 adults (one of them looks like he ate a couple of the kids) and 11 children, along with land payments. That’s hoping they actually paid for the garden shed out of the $65 grand they got in donations instead of another ‘rent to own’ deal.

    Where’s the extra money coming from for any improvements to the BLH, let alone one of the most vital of all, water? In order to barter, you need at least 2 things, something worth trading for and the goodwill of people interested in trading. Neither of which they have.

    I’ll let you in on an open secret, Joe & Nicole: It’s hard work, just to have the basics and it takes both of you, working your ass off to gain anything beyond the most basic needs. To date, you’ve failed at that and only continue to manage because you’ve grown so adept at ‘hinting’ to your followers of things you admire or want/need. It’s become so commonplace to you, you’re no longer ashamed of doing it.

    Do you want your children to respect and admire you? Then give them something worth respecting and admiring. You don’t get either by doing nothing more than behaving as animals, breeding and dropping a new litter every couple of years.

    Just how do you plan to be self-sufficient if you can’t get beyond the bare essentials without begging?

    How?

  7. Totally incompetent as parents. Baffling. For a couple of thousand bucks out of that $40G, they could have set up a nice water harvesting unit, complete with filtration at any time, and still we read her saying they have plans for one AFTER the spring thaw. Last summer at least I would have set up a simple rain collection system for a non potable water source. Maybe cost a couple days labor and $200-300.
    I do hope church lady publicized locally to all of her needy neighbors, her willingness to share her water so freely. Charity begins at home, or so I’ve heard.
    Looking at the picture of the neighbor’s farm and the snowy car, it appears the new BLshed is pretty visible from the road. Maybe explains why her paranoia about visitors is so active.
    BLB another winner!

  8. Renting space, as Nicole does, in a shopping center often comes with water included-you pay electric. As a grooming shop, there may be a different arrangement since the water bill for that space would be significantly higher than say a dress shop. If they are carting all the *family water needs* from that shop, taking 10 showers a day (?) that bill must be outrageous.

  9. What the hell did the GFM money do to improve their homestead? From what I can see, it paid for the Amish shed outright (under $8,000, unless that was on a payment plan), vinyl flooring, some burn pile and pond fencing (unless that was donated), possibly the dumpster for clean-up day, at least one iPad and maybe new phones. Who knows, maybe a new camera for Nicole. Likely the children did NOT get $3,000 in laptops that were itemized in the GFM (someone donated Kindles to the kids). Did the children get new mattresses, or bedding? Something to toilet in other than a bucket in a wood chamber sitting on pallets? Any type of camping shower at least for summer?

    Where. The Hell. Did the money go?
    How about: A 2+ week stay at the Golden Manor Motel (air-conditioned, with clean real beds, showers and a pool—something the Nauglers deny their own 10 children), meals out at restaurants, $400 in fireworks, and a whopping bill from their attorney/attorneys. They couldn’t have asked for a public defender?

    The GFM stated that a large portion of the funds were going to make their homestead more sanitary and habitable with “a permanent solution” to their water issues and outhouse. So, the permanent solution they came up with is to bathe the family at Nicole’s business. An on-grid pet salon.

    The Nauglers defrauded the public. They claimed the $45,000 was going to very items and goals. Nicole has repeatedly refused to account for how the money got spent. Flat out will not give supporters a spreadsheet. The diehards “trust her and Joe” and “have faith” that the money was spent according to the Nauglers’ needs. Angry donors already demanded refunds. Anyone else who did not donate, but continues to question this is just a hating troll. For calling out the Nauglers on fraud, a criminal offense.

    I have one more comment re the GFM. Not only did the Nauglers misrepresent to the public how the money would really be spent, Go Fund Me specifically prohibits fundraising for attorney fees involved in any criminal actions. If even one dime of that GFM money was spent on legal for Joe’s menacing charges, or Nicole’s charges for resisting arrest, that is in violation of GFM rules, and the Nauglers could be sued for that.

    That’s neither here nor there. Those 11 Naugler children deserve to have water, water, everywhere on the homestead.

  10. It takes two to tango. The same thing goes for consent. Everything, even the children being removed, falls on Joe and Nicole. In my opinion they didn’t sacrifice their children for an ideology, they sacrificed their children to cover their own butts. Eight weeks separated from everything they know, in strange places, away from each other, for what? Joe was charged, convicted and jailed anyway. They like to blame everyone else for every little thing, but I believe this one is squarely on them. It could have been avoided so easily.

    A simple phone call to ask if they can come by for water or a “sorry ma’am” when asked to leave the property, and nothing would have come of the incident.

    How they have worked and worked to spin these stories to their advantage. All the falsehoods aimed at frothing up the mouths of innocent people. I think that is what bothers me the most, after the children’s circumstances. All the people who through the goodness of their hearts and honesty in their souls who are actually taken in by the falsehoods, the mom and pop self promoting propaganda machine aimed at improving their lives by bullshitting and taking from others, IMO.

    Even then it might not be bad if one saw any improvements not assuredly mandated by the state. God forbid, they should do it for their children without coercion. God forbid they should put their children’s welfare before their own.

  11. Cynthia, They owed back taxes, (20G I think), back child support, GFM takes 5%s , and did Pace get a cut? She’s forced to back pay child support now, so apparently the IRS bill was settled for some amount?
    We really don’t know how much they are left sitting on, if any.
    But their brand of FB poverty sells well to their flock. Keeps the faithful rats sending in the requested shoes, overalls, teething necklaces, books, fireworks, clothing, face paints, etc. Donations would tend to dwindle I’d guess if the Nauglers suddenly started showing off successful independent homesteading life. It’s a life I guess the Mr. & Mrs. love. Live at the dog salon with all the modern amenities, Big Mac’s, internet fantasy, etc, then camp out at the compound for a few photo ops, this for the Mr. & Mrs. that is, the kids, well, “they freerange”. I hope one day soon the kids can escape and learn to be more than beggars and fraudsters. JMHO

  12. It is discouraging. I wonder how many people think those kids will have a successful raised garden if for no other reason than where it is located. Yet when she was offered suggestions, she said it is not a how-to blog but about what they are doing. People have offered suggestions about water and she says “we do not have a water source problem”.

    A decent Guardian ad Litem would be following everything she and Joe write including the baiting those who feel strongly they are making bad decisions that are impacting the children’s lives. As it stands now, those children don’t have a chance in Hell unless that Guardian ad Litem stresses some changes.

  13. Through all of this, the Nauglers have had an enduring set of resources: dirt, sticks, and water from the land; old concrete blocks and wood from the assorted trashed trailers; many pairs of hands; and time (since one of the adults does not appear to have had a steady job for a long time). They also, obviously, have the Internet, for everything from Craigslist to how-to pages. So here’s a partial list of stuff they could have built in the past two years with all that.

    1. Stakeouts and pens for their goats and chickens, to keep them away from the pond. A low fence or even a line of concrete blocks ditto, to remind the kids to stay out of it too.

    2. A shaduf to dip water out of the pond with minimal back strain. Can be rigged with poles, rope, a piece of junk for a weight, and a bucket.

    3. A boiling station down by the pond to make the water ready for drinking. Judging from Mrs. Naugler’s open-air kitchen, she can easily make one of these.

    4. A line of pallets on which to stack firewood, with a tarp over the top if needed. A stump or block nearby to use for neatly splitting and stacking wood.

    5. A real humanure system.

    6. A compost heap.

    7. A garden set up for vegetables that can be preserved at minimal expense. (Hint: Not corn.) With a rack for tools. And daily tillage, weeding, etc.

    8. A root cellar, if this doesn’t violate the (apparent) clause forbidding permanent structures until the land is paid off. A root cellar dug into a hillside is the cheapest food preservation system I know of.

    Yes, they would still be living in whatever non-permanent structures they could afford (for six years?!), but if somebody (hint not a child hint hint) had been out there moving a chicken tractor and goat stakes, turning piles, chopping wood, tending the garden, checking the root cellar, and dipping and boiling water every day, instead of posting nasty pictures about people and driving around the neighborhood being a thief, they would at least have clean water and identifiable food.

    But that would take sustained daily effort.

  14. I have a well and despite the water being free, the electricity is NOT. Nor would I give or even sell an unlimited amount to anyone, particularly not a family with livestock. If I did so, I wouldn’t have water in my well as it is a limited resource. Sulfurous water doesn’t smell good and it’s not helpful when laundering, but there are filters. Of course, you have to first get someone to check out your water source.

    I think the fact that Joe and one or more of the boys left the water running from that hose wasn’t intentional. If it was Joe then it was his way of “showing them”. If it was one of the boys, perhaps it was his way of ALERTING them that something was very wrong. If DR is on municipal water, then they are paying more for it as they USE more of it (the rate increases with the volume used). I know that because my parents are on municipal water and that was hammered into my head from 1974 onward. They’re still frugal with water. Any drips from the sink are collected and used for the houseplants in the winter; houseplants and outside plants during the rest of the year, etc.

    I certainly hope that if it was one of the children they left that hose running as a signal, not for spite.

    So she bought jugs of water and then refilled them at work (someplace where she was paid by another). Does this mean she had permission to fill up many jugs of water on her employer’s dime? Does anyone know if the local feed store actually permits people to get water for free and is there a limit (5 gallons per family? 5 gallons per person? What about the livestock?)? I mean, it’s one thing to get a BIG drink of water when you’re there and clearly hot and thirsty, it’s quite another to load up multiple 5 gallon buckets. I still don’t know why they don’t purchase and use a dry camp. They would fit into the van and you can choose between 50 and 100 gallons. There are even the kind that stand upright if you don’t want to trip over them. Might be a bit too tall for the van though…

  15. In addition, that $6500 building was either returned (per Nicole) or repossessed (far more likely). So they completely and utterly failed to make keeping a roof over their children’s heads OR supplying them with potable water a priority. Whatever they were spending their money on wasn’t either of those two basic necessities.

    They did succeed in alienating an extensive community of people who had the know-how to assist them in building a cabin. A cabin with supports to raise the floor off the ground (so it wouldn’t proceed to rot straightaway), level, sturdy and even proceed to teach them how to build bunk beds so the kids could have some small measure of privacy. Maybe they would have made two rooms with a wall and a door – one for the girls and the other for the boys. Mom and Dad could have kipped out in the great room to keep the fire going when it was cold, cuddle the youngest of the children if they wished and also enjoyed a degree of adult privacy from their children. Even a loft for storage (or escape) could have been incorporated.

    I never saw that they ever shared what their vision for the cabin would have been. They had plans though.

    If only they had planned their garden better. This year they could be harvesting rhubarb but that’s not going to happen now.

  16. Very good and succinct, Blessed Little Blogger. The timeline history reveals important blessed little details. The incident with DR, well that explains the non transparency. IMO, they feel a sense of entitlement. Maybe not the entitlement off the government tit. But entitled demands from the responsible community neighbors, who have a different set of priorities at their homesteads. Primarily, maintaining a basic water source. Possibly differing mantras too, those that feel an entitlement and those that own responsibility. There is nothing uncharitable in desiring someone else to learn to provide for themselves, and getting off the entitlement dependent tit. But we see what happens, when the outsourced water source doesn’t want to participate in the transaction anymore. Or the transaction is occurring involuntarily and unknown to the participant. Here comes the “mean person”, “cunt”, and handling the matter privately. That’s bullshit!

    It would seem that the issue of acquiring portable water to sustain the homestead needs, should of been a more temporary solution. Not a two years and counting “outsourcing” project!

    It’s challenging to want to feel sorry for their not having acquired a permanent water solution, when there has been neighborly interest in advising and apparent offers to help. When priorities are not aligned properly. When there are able bodied adults, no feeble or disabled or ill stricken. When there are 11 dependent children.

    FB Refugee said it well, “But their brand of FB poverty sells well to their flock. Keeps the faithful rats sending in the requested shoes, overalls, teething necklaces, books, fireworks, clothing, face paints, etc. Donations would tend to dwindle I’d guess if the Nauglers suddenly started showing off successful independent homesteading life. “

  17. http://hardinsburg.ky.gov/Documents/In%20Town-Plant%20Main-County.pdf

    If DR and her family lived within Hardinsburg, then the cost is about 10¢/gallon (I rounded up to incorporate the electricity costs) for the first 2000 gallons. I don’t know if their home was metered to also record how much of the water was going back into the system (sewer rates) or if it was assumed that any water going into the house was going to go through the sewer system too. If the hose was left running for hours, then Joe and Nicole owed DR quite a bit more than $2 or even $20 for what they stole that day.

    Not only that, if Joe had done this once, there is no reason to believe he hadn’t done it before. Wasn’t there someone who posted online that her family couldn’t figure out why their water bill had suddenly shot up, until they found the hose on one day? Maybe it was DR’s family who posted that information. Although there is no reason to believe they were the only family affected by Joe’s inattention to detail (turning the water OFF after you steal it so as not to draw attention to your activities).

  18. If they’d actually been able to make the words “We made a terrible mistake” come out of their mouths, they could’ve created an online presence as a scrappy couple fighting their way up from the absolute bottom for the sake of their children. “2 Broke Homesteaders: Building a New Life Out of Junk and Hard Work.” Daily photos of progress around the homeplace, and a PayPal button on the right.

    Well, if they’d ever been able to follow up a plan with consistent hard work.

    But the pathology in this family goes deep…Mrs. Naugler insisting that her children love sleeping in a pile, Mr. Naugler’s utter inability to keep from screwing off at every single job he’s ever had–watching TV for hours at the hotel where he was supposed to be working!–the inability to consider that the most convenient thing right now may have bad consequences later…

  19. There’s something not shared about the large GFM donation. It went to pay for things that can’t be talked about, payback for something, support for anarchist political ideologies, saved as a nestegg for when they can make their escape, or perhaps it was identified as a scam by GFM and they never got the $$. Maybe we’ll know someday, or not.

    Whatever happened, money was not spent on the current not-a-homestead. Even if it’s not their forever home, water is basic.

    Seeing the close proximity of the neighbor who fills a pool for entertainment and relaxation tells me there is at least some extra water available in rural Kentucky. It also tells me that the neighbor cooks, cleans, bathes, waters plants/crops, washes clothes, has a toileting system, tends to animals, etc. – because these kinds of water needs would be attended to before the luxury wants of a pool.

    The N’s have no water, except what they can find and carry.

    In 2016, in America, their water situation is an example of a failure of voluntaryism, a failure in common sense, a failure to work, and incomprehensible priorities of the adults. These parents purposefully neglect to provide water for their family’s needs.

  20. This is 2016 America, one of the richest nations on the planet, and here we have a family whose 11 children have no water or sanitation at their home. One of probably many rural American families who live in this type of poverty. This is not just an issue of the Nauglers. This issue is a deeper conversation about the culture and mindset of self-perpetuating poverty. It is driven by people who are embittered, hopeless, feel entitled (either to welfare or “voluntary charity”, the Naugler variety) and either refuse or cannot see that hard work and compromise offer an escape ladder from the cycle of poverty.

    It’s a combination of environmental and genetic factors. Why are certain people thrivers amidst struggles, whilst others merely survive, just barely? One answer would is that the latter do not have the mental health needed to make good choices, to compromise, to distinguish delusions from reality, to recognize realistic goals vs. pipe dreams. Disenfranchisement can also steam from adults having had an abusive upbringing, or never succeeding academically, or merely living in poverty among influences that were hopeless.

    What differentiates those people for whom water and sanitation is a critical first priority for their children–and would work 3 jobs before allowing their children to live in filth—from those who continue to have more and more children they cannot afford, and subject them to living without real toilets or water?

    IMHO, this deep conversation about self-perpetuating poverty is also about mental health. About providing those struggling poverty the access to better education, job training and life skills training. To provide those with mental health issues easier access to services, without the governmental obstacle course currently in place.

    Perhaps if the Naugler parents had had access to job skills training, and to counseling, to mental, dental, medical services that Obama did so earnestly want to make available to all American citizens, regardless of income, these services may have helped them make better choices in life.

  21. “Perhaps if the Naugler parents had had access to job skills training, and to counseling, to mental, dental, medical services that Obama did so earnestly want to make available to all American citizens, regardless of income, these services may have helped them make better choices in life.”

    Perhaps, but recall that Nicole does avail herself of income-based/free dental care, has been offered all sorts of “learn to fish” help by many different people (family and non-family) and by the state but she absolutely won’t take it. She’ll take $$ from anyone who gives it but won’t stir or tell Joe to get off his derriere and go take a class with a master gardener, go to the county extension agent and get the soil tested, ask anyone in the area who clearly HAS figured it out to a greater degree than the Naugler’s how they did it, took notes and then followed through with doing a better job.

    They talk about “plans” but they’re pretty vague. They’re going to build a cabin, but there’s no discussion about how many rooms, or how they are going to give the girls and boys some privacy. They’re going to set up a garden, but they don’t discuss testing the soil, orientation, prevailing winds, exactly how they’re going to water it and what they’re going to plant with the idea of feeding the family. They’ve already explored chickens and rabbits, to the detriment of both. I haven’t heard anything new about the goats. I do recall photos of a completely inadequate set-up for the rabbits. The Naugler’s didn’t even know that you bring the doe to the buck – not the other way around. She’ll kill him if given half a chance.

    I suspect success would slow the flow of free money. They’re not interested in that happening. They need that money and they don’t want anything to mess it up. Not even taking their responsibilities seriously is enough to slow their roll.

    Imagine, having to purchase their own “amber teething necklace” for their youngest child rather than raising the topic, then waiting for someone to offer to send it to them. Why isn’t it ever that they purchased, used and talked up a product FIRST rather than hinting for a donation?

    You can’t force people to take advantage of mental health services. There is a certain amount of “thou shalt” for physical (a compound fracture really should be seen by a real M.D., with access to x-rays, a medical degree, insurance, etc.) rather than just settling for a splint. Not to mention a tetanus shot.

    I wonder what Jeannette Walls or her siblings would have to say to them. She was raised in challenging circumstances by parents who weren’t very accepting of the status quo, but at least they took education very seriously. I haven’t seen her defending the Naugler’s way of life, so she may not believe they’re doing right by their kids.

  22. Well spoken, They Need Help, Not The $$$ Kind. I read over a couple times, to absorb what you said.

    Your commentary should be valued so much more than enabling and/or overlooking the big elephant in the room. Sort of like the great social and education experiment years ago. Where every child got a trophy in sports. Atta boys. And eliminated red ink in grading paperwork. What favors do we do the kids, how are we helping them?

    I hope the Nauglers see your commentary. And I hope close supporters see it. Mental Health issues do not need enablers or overlooking like it’s not there. The perpetual has been going on a long, long time.

    You are so right, they need help. And not the $$$ kind.

  23. @TheyNeedHelp: Tekla nailed it, I think. The kind of help the Nauglers need is directed at fixing errors, and the kind of mental screwed-up-ness the Nauglers have does not allow them to ever, ever admit an error.

  24. If they do have the money, but will not spend even a pittance of it, they may not be planning on staying at the BLH. Their history is nomadic especially when they get caught by the law. (Keep your hopes up locals).
    Probably they never imagined KY CPS would shackle them this long so a more sustainable water source at the compound was not considered. The salon was the short term solution, but for whatever reasons, the salon water has now probably become their financial responsibility, I’m betting, and thus we see the water greedy stories being resurrected.

    I do agree on the mental illness, but there is also the issue of criminal behavior against children, and using children (or pregnancy) to avoid or temper consequences. This is the line they are always teetering on. IMO

    Tekla, thanks for the links. Hadn’t seen those in a while, and to think she gave birth there in the winter without a good water source. Sick.

  25. This is from an NYT article about Jeannette Walls. I’ve selected some passages.

    “Given her background, it’s no surprise that her default instinct is to impose order. Walls’s childhood was peripatetic, to say the least — her parents had 27 addresses in the first five years of their marriage. They were not only running out on the rent, but her father was convinced that the F.B.I. was after them. They finally landed in Rex’s Appalachian hometown, Welch, W.Va., in a three-room house without plumbing or heat, infested with snakes and rats. Walls says she still has nightmares about the yellow bucket the six of them used each night as a toilet.”

    “As we walked toward Rose Mary’s cottage, I admired how idyllic it looked — white clapboard with a white-picketed porch and a flower garden. When the door opened, we were instantly transported to the squat. The stench of cat urine was an almost-physical entity, pushing against the piles of garbage and crusted-over cat food in myriad dishes. One room was so filled with junk that it was impossible to enter. I remembered Walls writing that when her mother had money to buy food, she always bought the dented cans “because they need love, too.”

    “Rose Mary, who is 78, was an amiable hostess, though we stood to talk. Her aqua jacket was coated in dust; her light blue T-shirt was heavily stained, as were her bluejeans. The filth, the stink, the boxes and the piles were like a force field separating her from the world.”

    “We left her to get straightened out and walked back to the house. The fresh air was welcome. “That was nothing to the smell I grew up with,” Walls said. “She smelled like that on ‘Oprah.’ When I asked her to take a shower, she said: ‘Nothing is ever good enough for you. You’re a perfectionist.’ ” She sighed, deflated. “To be ashamed of your people is a bad thing.”

    snip

    “I’ve got four flush toilets in this house, O.K.? Push the little lever, life is good. I got heat, push the little buttons, life is really good. I will never take anything for granted. It is a miracle to me that I can go to a grocery store and don’t have to stop counting at $3.”

    Doesn’t sound as though she would want to recreate her experience for her own family, near or extended. I do so a bit of the “circle the wagons” ’round the family but then again, we all do that to some extent or another.

    I would be saddened if my children basically saw me as a cautionary tale. Not saying there are portions they would prefer didn’t happen, or happened differently, but overall they aren’t looking to flee hide their upbringing. Of course I don’t view rooting in garbage or begging for my daily bread as acceptable though.

  26. I live in fucking Oregon and should NOT have to be dealing with this shit

    Nobody is twisting your arm, nk.

  27. Until it went viral.

    Bingo. I for one never heard of the Nauglers until they made sure their story “went viral.” They did it. Not me. Not the locals. Nobody but them.

  28. Dear NK,

    Slow down, take a breath. Okay?

    Where was the church? Why they were helping for quite a long time, until they realized they had vipers in their midst. They put up and mostly shut up, until they were attacked by the Nauglers.

    Employers? Why they gave them work. That is until the Nauglers quit or did something to force the employer to terminate their employment.

    Locals? Why they were taking care of their own business. The Nauglers in the Olivia video made it known they were hiding the fact that they lived on the property. I believe ordered the children to say they were camping? The locals only became aware when the Nauglers made it their business by going viral and calling in the troops to attack the local government.

    Now, we have all since learned that both the Cabinet and the Sheriff were doing their best within the confines of the law to help, but the Nauglers wanted no part of it.

    You purportedly live in Oregon, you aren’t local. All you have to do is walk away. It’s that easy for you. Not so easy for the locals.

  29. NK, maybe BLB had a hot date last night and didn’t get around to approving your comments until the AM. No one is “censoring” you for f$&@s sake. If you live in Oregon how do you know so much about the Nauglers? How do you think you know more than the locals? Why should you/we believe the Nauglers over what many other locals have said? Are you drunk? Maybe you should take a Xanax. This seems to be affecting you more than it should.

  30. I want to point out that homeless people can be very resourceful AND they can recognize the need for tidiness and having clean water. It has since been bulldozed, but it goes to show that even people who are in dire circumstances can be health conscious and civic-minded. Now, there are some people who are really, really messed up and this level of community wouldn’t be sustainable. This place was ‘founded’ in 2003 – I can’t come up with a better term at the moment. It was torn down by the township in 2014.

    http://www.economicnoise.com/2011/03/10/tent-city-nj/

    Perhaps the Naugler adults can aspire to such heights of organization and cleanliness. Yes, it took time for the camp to get things together but I don’t think they were utilizing the internet to the same degree. I may be wrong.

  31. BLB had a hot date last night and didn’t get around to approving your comments

    🙂 I have had some amazing “love letters” from the Nauglers and their rabid supporters, and that has necessitated that I approve each comment manually. This is really not a public space. It is owned and operated by me (and those who have chosen to help me). People are allowed to comment here as a courtesy. It’s not a right.

    You are not guaranteed that your comment will see the light of day if I do not approve it. That is not “censoring.” That is simply private enterprise (something I think Nicole and Joe hold near and dear to their slimy little hearts).

    As a general guideline, your comment will be approved if you do not call me terrible names in all caps, if you are of legal age (the Naugler children may not comment here), and if you avoid delving too much into forbidden subjects (the grooming business in any detail and specifics about the children being two of those forbidden subjects).

  32. To NK.
    I offered to mentor the children when they complained online that no one offered to mentor the children. I convinced a lot of people who knew nothing about the family to offer their services. Okay, so the Naugler parents didn’t want me near their kids, dumb choice in my opinion, but understandable when you realize that they lump every critic into the “haters” camp regardless of the level of criticism. What about those other people who were offering their expertise and time freely? Rejected. What about people who offer online? Mostly blocked and banned, and relegated to obscurity. At what point in time does one come to the conclusion that they do not want help, unless it comes in one of two forms, money and goods?

  33. NK, take a chill pill and then get your facts straight FFS. I think you were fed an entirely twisted version of the truth. Nicole and Joe made a huge mistake when they went viral. If they had only learned to shut up, clean up their act and get adult, life would be so much better for them. Even her Mama begged her to find a quiet space and get her head on straight.

  34. I would like to address nk’s concerns if I may.

    nk, I can see that you are very upset right now. What I think you may not realize is that since this is a blog, rather than facebook or some other site, comments do not appear instantly. They sit in a queue awaiting approval, not censorship approval. The Blogger needs to be actively online to approve a comment. If the Blogger is off doing other things, it may take hours before a comment is approved – this is the same for all of us.

    From your typing, I can surmise that you are very angry and agitated, likely leading to your belief that you’d written more to a comment than you actually did. Unless you named the business or a child, nothing would be edited out of your comment. The Blogger has some rules, I believe those are two of them. I have noticed that when something is censored the Blogger mentions it immediately.

    Now for the big stuff. The locals were handling things the in a normal matter prior to May. They were contacting LE about Joe coming onto their property, they were seeing that the child who was walking on the road far from home was returned, they were contacting CPS. They were dealing with it day by day, incident by incident.

    I would be very interested to hear your story. How are you involved all the way from OR that requires the local or federal law enforcement agencies, especially if it is a trivial matter?

    Please explain to us. Maybe some of the other readers are having similar issues and afraid to speak up. Maybe we can learn from you or even help you.

    My sincerest sympathy goes out to you with these issues.

  35. nk wrote, ” I live in fucking Oregon and should NOT have to be dealing with this shit but I am…..fuck me for caring”

    Does this mean that you are an experienced homesteader (possibly a voluntaryist) and will be appearing on the Naugler’s property in order to teach them what they really need to know to thrive due to diligence and thrift, rather than survive? If you wish to remain, I advise that you bring money because your hard-won expertise won’t be necessary. In fact, it’s discouraged. There are many classes and teachers available in the area for very little money but you see how much time was invested in learning from them. I see someone has offered an apprenticeship to the Naugler’s and I don’t see any comment that it will be put into effect. Darn.

    It’s not a question of caring, we all care (about the kids). This is a question of two adults who aren’t disciplined enough to stick with a task to see it succeed or fail and their efforts made a difference. Mostly, they start things and when it doesn’t go well, they give up. Then they blog about it in hopes that their readers will bail them out yet again.

    I do wonder how many of the early readers remain. I mean those outside of the family! Nicole and Joe take special pains in churning the readership. Fewer witnesses and testimonies to their decline and failures.

    It appears as though once they had more than 5 children, it was just a bit too much. I have no doubt they love their children but maybe if they had spaced them a bit more or decided that five living children (Nicole has written that she suffered two spontaneous abortions due to Rh incompatibility [hard to believe that Nicole didn’t know her blood type at least after the first miscarriage]) were sufficient blessings they never would have lost their $6500 shed. Nor would they have found themselves removing seats from the van and running it for warmth in the dead of winter (risking carbon monoxide poisoning).

    Now, as for the whole amber teething necklace thing – not everything sold as amber is amber. There are a lot of unscrupulous people who will sell you resin that has been tarted up and passed off as amber. Rather than trust that succinic acid can be absorbed through the skin or gums, get to the area in question and in sufficient quantities to relieve the pain (anecdotal) – why not purchase a little Ambesol and know what you’re getting? Rub a small amount on the irritated gum area. If I’m honest, I would be amused if the Naugler’s were conned but that isn’t fair to the children. Then again, Nicole is expecting people to send her all sorts of nice things out of the goodness of their hearts. Plus cash. I don’t doubt not a few send cash despite being evil ‘statists’.

  36. Dearest NK,

    Nicole censors people on her blog and public Facebook pages all.the.time. Why should the BLB held to a higher standard?

    Warmest regards,
    Pip

  37. Now she wants it down? I thought she was angry because it wasn’t up fast enough.

    That was last night, I think. I’m just being polite and answering.

  38. Oh, and I do not have any reason to believe that “nk” is a minor, and every reason (which I won’t go into here due to privacy issues) to believe that she is an adult, even if she isn’t acting like one at the moment.

  39. nk, “I noticed that the bishops daughter doesnt’t have a formal complaint.”

    Bishop’s wife. Perhaps that particular LDS church in Elizabethtown were simply so relieved that they left the ward and moved elsewhere they decided not to pursue legal options. I don’t know when the statute of limitations is up for their various complaints and I doubt they shared all of them publicly.

    nk – Once you hit send it’s no longer yours. That’s why it’s best to sleep on it when you’re upset. If you had had the presence of mind to read some of the older threads you may have noticed that there is often a lag of hours and then a whole bunch of posts. Almost as though someone (our host) was asleep, or busy, or just not sitting with bated breath by the internet waiting for our collective wit & wisdom.

    I sometimes wonder if our kind host grabs a nice hot beverage, fires up the interwebz, sits down and then thinks, “What fresh hell is this?” (Credit to Dorothy L. Parker)

  40. nk – You may have missed a lesson or two in cotillion. You forgot to say, “Please”. It often gets you a lot further than, “you people are evil!! Take my stuff down now3!! Pass it on.

  41. My dear NK,
    To return to the topic of this post; as I was taking a nice hot shower this morning, I was again, thinking about the lack of water, hot water even for the kids.
    But, forget about me. I’m censoring myself right now. Otherwise I would not be very nice to NK.
    The Naugler adults have not done right by their children, in every way imaginable. That is apparent to everyone, even the ‘supporters’ if they are thinking, caring individuals. In my honest opinion, many of the ‘supporters’ believe that mother Naugler would shut them off from posting if they posted their true feelings. She’s done it before, and I personally believe she holds it over the heads of those ‘supporters’ left. Why it should matter to them is very much a quandary.
    Finally, NK, since you are in Oregon, have you been to Burns and the Refuge in Princeton? The locals in Burns need your help to get their lives back together after the Refuge Militia Bundy fiasco. You could be of much more help there, since it is closer than KY.

  42. nk wrote, ” I shouldn’t have to deal with the locals or the feds on a fucking trivial matter that COUL:D have been dealt with by the locals… FUG YOU LOCALS FOR NOT dEALING WITH IT!!!!!!!!!!!!!! I live in fucking Oregon and should NOT have to be dealing with this shit but I am…”

    I agree. You shouldn’t be dealing with it unless you’re one of the immediate family, and even then, unless you’re Joe or Nicole, you should just wave from the corner and let them deal with their own shit. That’s pretty much what we’ve been saying all along. Those 2 are supposed to be adults. They are supposed to parent 11 kids. They are supposed to provide life’s basic necessities for their children, first and foremost.

    Why is it *anyone’s* responsibility to “deal” with this other than Joe and Nicole’s? All we are doing is keeping them honest – they lay out the spin and BS and we call ’em on it. We show when they’ve lied; and they do that often, as we will continue to display.

    If you can’t stand the heat, get out of the kitchen cause the fire will continue burning until they do the right thing by their children…not themselves. To be perfectly frank, I don’t give a rat’s ass about them. If those two fell off the face of the earth tonight, it wouldn’t bother me in the least. Maybe the kids could have all the things they don’t have now…warm, clean clothing, a warm home, all they can eat, a clean soft bed with privacy, hot water and a place to bathe…all the things we take for granted.

    On second thought, if you’re “having to deal with this” how about you provide all those things for the kids? Huh?

  43. Who is this “nk”? Is this someone that we know? Why is this person so angry? I guess I’m a bit confused as to why this person posted those comments. Is this a Naugler supporter who is going to help them personally? Or is this just some random poster from Oregon who has his/her panties in a wad because this blog provides accurate information about a scamming, dishonest couple who continues to allow their precious children to live in squalor?

  44. Good question Angela, I’m confused by the statement,
    “I shouldn’t have to deal with the locals or the feds on a fucking trivial matter that COUL:D have been dealt with by the locals” NK
    What “fucking trivial matter” are you dealing with NK, and the feds? What’s up with the feds?

    BLB, BEST response of the day, “Dear NK, No.”
    Guess the usual MO of insane FB rants, followed by deletion didn’t work so well here.
    Just dying, best EVER!!!
    This water issue, resurrected by NICOLE, seems to have hit a nerve…
    BLB skip the hot beverage, go straight for the good stuff and celebrate! JMHO

  45. I believe that nk is likely a person who got on the Nauglers’ bad side and has had to deal with doxxing and harassment from them to the point where they are frightened and angry.

    I think likely this person came here to vent their feelings of vulnerability and did not do so well. I think they were desperately trying to find answers where there are none.

    This is just my suspicion. I can not confirm it.

  46. To NK (Nittany Knight?):
    I am sorry you regret having left your comments here, but as you’ve seen this is not FB where you can suddenly delete what you wrote, as Nicole frequently has done and continues to do. She has frequently appeared on a “hater” page (quotations to reflect her view, not mine) to argue. Then for no apparent reason, she will disappear and delete every remark she made. Which is ludicrous as both she and the non-supporters are in the habit of taking screenshots of conversations. So it doesn’t really go away. It’s always prudent to think about what you say publicly.

    You seem very passionate about defending the Nauglers from all the way over in Oregon. I urge you to please look closer, because the parents are not what they would have you believe.

    Simply because neighbors or church members in Kentucky did not prosecute the Nauglers does not mean they do not have real issues with them. Much of what the Nauglers have been accused of doing is not easily prosecutable. Being an obnoxious jerk is not a crime. Having zero gratitude for charity and kindness extended is not a crime, even if the beneficiaries of the charity sell the furniture that they were given. Just because the community didn’t rise up in collective arms against the Nauglers doesn’t mean bad behavior didn’t happen. Many of the incidents were disparate, involving people in different areas of KY and Texas. It would not have been until the Nauglers went viral with the CPS case, that people who had had poor experiences with them found one another and compared notes.

    Lastly, much of the Nauglers’ parasitic behavior occurred within the LDS church wards. The Nauglers lived off church charity—rent, food, clothing. The wards expected this to be a temporary situation. When Joe refused to get a job, they stopped the support. Joe’s manner of dealing with this may have been angry and aggressive, but if he didn’t punch out a bishop, what was the ward going to do? The Nauglers may have vindictively left their rental house filthy and with feces everywhere, but truly, what was the landlord going to do? File a small claims action and get a judgment that the Nauglers could not pay? What was the church going to do? Everyone was just relieved to have them leave.

    Noxious behavior—including personal arrogance, aggression, spitefulness, entitlement, chronic begging, may alienate the community but is not usually against the law. It flies just under the radar. The Nauglers became very good at this. Until they raised $45,000 in a GFM and people started to take a closer look.

    You too, Nittany, look closer. It won’t make you a hater….. to the contrary. All of the people who comment here do so because, like you, they care. For the CHILDREN. They, not the parents, are the true victims here.

  47. 1. It is not illegal to collect rainwater in 26 states. It’s not even illegal in the few states where it is regulated.

    2. The “feds” do not think the rainwater belongs to them. In lots of places, rainwater goes into the ground, yes, but it is not “wasted,” it goes into the aquifer. Everyone gets their water from the aquifer that has a well. If you take all the water, or seriously remove a lot of it, you impact all the other people who are using the aquifer. How hard is this to understand? In those areas, you need to get a permit to collect rainwater, but it’s no different than getting a permit to connect to the electric pole. Requiring a permit doesn’t make the activity “illegal.”

    3. I could find nothing whatever about some man in Oregon who was supposedly arrested for digging a fish pond. There was a guy in Oregon who erected two enormous dams without a water rights permit, which is the incident that Dawn seems to be referencing quite erroneously. (See my link above.)

    4. It took me exactly two minutes to find this stuff.

    5. Nobody, of course, can post this on Nicole’s Blessed Little Bogus Homestead page, because she will flip out and ban you. However, she will read it here. She also will totally ignore it and let the nasty remarks about the evil government remain.

  48. Dear NK, if those blog is going to upset you so much, maybe its not for you.

    On another note, I tend to lean towards fact more then fiction. This blog is not only well written, but has fact checked and given proof to every point made. I’m sorry if that upsets you. If the truth is so very unsettling, perhaps your would be better served reading the http://blessedlittlehomestead.blogspot.com/, its a mostly fiction blog, so it will be easier on your poor frazzled Oregonian nerves.

  49. I think nk is quite a bit closer than Oregon…..I would say in the next room, but the shed is only one room. This whole ordeal has gotten so out of hand, and I might add, by the Naugler’s own doing. From day one they wanted attention and they got it. It just happened to backfire on them because they don’t have any experience in handling real life crises. Not in a mature fashion, not by a long shot. The best thing that could happen for those kids is to be removed from such an unstable environment. The supposed adults in this situation have made it quite clear they want no advice from anyone, just the cash, no questions asked. And they are more than “put off” when you want to know where the money went. I don’t understand the supporters agreeing with them, saying it’s nobody’s business where the money went….especially when they made statements as to what was going to be done with the money and you see no proof that they’ve done what they said they were planning to do with the money. Any sane person would check out a charity before donating. When you see that 95% of the money is going to administration….you don’t donate, that or you might as well throw your money away.
    The longer this is going on, the more unstable the parents seem to be. Over the past few months it seems she is becoming more and more unstable. The addiction to the internet….primarily all of these facebook accounts. It would be one thing to be online in general, but to be assuming all these different identities. There are too many for me….

  50. Heather MM says:
    February 15, 2016 at 4:45 pm
    I believe that nk is likely a person who got on the Nauglers’ bad side and has had to deal with doxxing and harassment from them to the point where they are frightened and angry.

    You nailed it. Exactly what I was thinking as I read the comment posted by NK.

    This is the exact reason I have never commented on the Naugler blog or Facebook accounts. I have said it here a few times. They are scary, scary people whom I do not trust.

  51. So something happened between 10:10 pm and 11:17 pm, that caused NK to order comments to be taken down? Michelle and Heather MM, may be correct about this. It does sound like someone frightened and angry.

    I am like you, Michelle. I have never commented on the Naugler Facebook accounts, BLH blog, the many Naugler “supporter” pages, or the sock accounts. For obvious reasons, as you stated.

  52. I really could use some extra cash. A Gfm is a great idea.

    The description of why I will need donations will be as follows:
    I need money. I need the money of kind strangers. Don’t ask why I need your money. I will not tell you what I will be spending your money on, it’s none of ya dayum business. Just trust me I need it.

    I wonder how many donations would come rolling in?

    This is the message the Naugs send to the kind people who sent the funds. A screw you would be more honest than skirting around the question.

  53. Personally, I think NK dropped the FED word as a tactical scare to try to stop people from reading or commenting on this blog.

    This blog has the Nauglers and their diehard supporter’s spanning on their head’s because the truth is being told. So they resort to any kind of threatening they can and drop the FED word as if any of us give a damm.

    Well since they are already spinning on their head’s….how about a little more dizziness?

    Guess What?

    Turn’s out we are not the dreaded TROLL’S Mr & Mrs Naugler keeps referring to us as after all.

    We are in fact “Public Viewers.”
    When the Nauglers decided to go virtual and make their situation public they gained ” Public Figure Status.”
    According to an Attorney I spoke with ” NONE OF THIS IS TROLLING ON OUR PART.”

    We the public are allowed to view any and all information out there. It is not our fault the Nauglers give it so freely everyday. After many of us has viewed the information available what you are seeing is called a ” PUBLIC OUT CRY ” for the children.
    Much like the Casey Anthony case.

    However, this is quite different because these two PUBLIC FIGURE’S ARE TOLLING, HURASSING, THREATENING their “Public Viewer’s.”
    They are also using their multiple Facebook Account’s, pages and blog’s to LABEL their Public Viewers as “TROLL’S” and insight their Supporter’s to join in and participate against Public Viewers who do not agree with them.

    All that is illegal.

    Now set down, take a deep breath and maybe your head will stop spinning after you think about this for awhile.
    We are not your TROLL’S honey….we are your Viewer’s !!!!
    Get use to that !!!!

  54. NK is Mr Naugler himself.
    He has made the statements about getting the feds to help him before.
    They do not trust the law but want them to help? That just amazes me. Nah not really I called his bullshit when he posted it.
    He is a big man with a big mouth and thinks he can scare people into doing what he wants them to do or get what he wants to get from them.

    Joe there is an old saying that my dad use to say and believe me it is true I listened to him and did it = The bigger they are the harder they fall. Some day you are going to threaten the wrong person (probably some little woman that looks like she can not take a fly on and win) that person is going to cold cock you right in your big fat pie hole and knock your ass to the ground. Believe me when a big guy hits the ground hard after being put in his place by a little woman with a cause even his friends and supporters are going to giggle and laugh. They might not do it your face cause I highly doubt many of then have gonads to stand up to your and the Mrs bullshit, but they will be doing it. When it happens I hope there is a video and it goes viral… put the shoe on your big foot after it is extracted from your fat mouth.

    NK could be the Mrs as she has changed her name and combined it with one of the kids names. Remember she put herself in time out again picked up her toys and shut the lights off on her pages to scrub them clean. Her dang facebook pages get scrubbed more than the shitshack and the kids clothes do. She takes a time out when she is having a melt down and has to remove stuff that will make her look not so Christian like, even though she says the curse words are okay for a Christian it might be the manner in which they are delivered.

    Joe be a real man get a job and support the kids. A real man that is abled body would not sit back on his fat arse doing nothing to improve the shit hole and make his wife work like a slave to support him so he can have money to go to Hardees when he gets a munchie binge. A real man works a real job for honest wages and supports his family. GTFU and prove you are a man other than just with your penis to make babies you can not or I should say will not support.

  55. Jack Livinashack wrote, “This is the message the Naugs send to the kind people who sent the funds. A screw you would be more honest than skirting around the question.”

    It would take someone presuming they’re honest people and they’ve disabused many of that notion. They haven’t done so with the world at large, yet.

  56. Yet another example of their asking leading questions of their followers:

    Feb 15, 2016
    “We have a long list of projects we would like to accomplish. They take time and money and as the old adage goes, you usually have one or the other.

    Our priority project is the garden. We have a few small secondary projects, a small counter in the kitchen, the rainwater collection system and the chicken coop. These are planned for completion by spring.

    Of course there are other projects that require a “roundtoit”. Much of our time is consumed with the daily tasks of having a large family, homeschooling, taking care animals and running a business. We will get to them as we can, no rush or stress.

    What projects would you like to complete? What projects have you completed recently?”

    Translation: We don’t have money, send us some.

    Small secondary project: rainwater collection system.

    Daily tasks of having a large family: emptying buckets of waste, scrounging water?

    They don’t have THAT many animals and having 5-6 helpers minimizes how much time it takes to feed and water them out of the day. We’re not talking about a dairy farm operation and having to ensure you’re ready when the milk truck arrives for pick-up. Or gathering hundreds of eggs for delivery.

    “Blessed Little Homestead Bees are on my list as well. Probably won’t be till later tho”

    They’ve had bees in the past but were unable to make a go of it. I do hope they’ve scaled their ambitions back to something they can manage. One or two hives until the kids’ skills have caught up with their parents’ ambitions.

    I didn’t see any mention of having started seeds for the garden by Nicole.

    It’s interesting to see that while they say they homeschool there is never any mention of general lesson plans. Another benefit of going to a school (public or private) is that the students and their parents are able to ask about the curriculum in advance as well as ongoing, often online. That’s not to say it was never changed or content was added, removed or moved around.

    There you go, world. Further documentation per their own writing that they have no intention of doing better.

    It hasn’t been mentioned lately, but have any of the children continued with their music lessons? It would have made more sense to put the piano at the shop where it would benefit from more consistent humidity and there are piano teachers who will travel to you and getting to the shop is a great deal easier than access to the blessed little hovel on the hill. Not to mention they appreciate flushing toilets and sinks with water, soap and a clean towel.

  57. Old Farm Girl wrote, “He is a big man with a big mouth and thinks he can scare people into doing what he wants them to do or get what he wants to get from them.”

    I can only imagine how big man of the shabby shack Joe, scares his children every day. You don’t have to hit kids to scare them. Scary words from a big Daddy is just as effective. Having to stay outta Moms way and always walking on eggshells so you don’t set her off destroys children too.

    It may well be one or more of his kids who take that loud mouth man down along with that sorry excuse for a Mom, Nicole. All they gotta do is tell the real truth about the Naugler family and the abuses that lurk within it.

    This is why they un-school the kids. It has nothing to do with not liking the public schools for the curriculum or brainwashing the kids. It has more to do with keeping the children isolated so they have no way of telling the truth. Sure, the kids had the chance when they were in care to tell the truth but they were not in care long enough to build trust with a caring adult to share their fears. Joe scares the wits out of them to stay quiet and the kids will suffer in quiet until they are rescued and know they don’t have to return to that hell.

    I pray the day those kids are rescued comes quick and the undoing of the parents is swift.

  58. Old farm girl wrote, “Nicole and Joe we are NOT EVER going away, we are going to be worst than herpes your life long baggage so LIVE with it! You wanted this to go viral”

    Sorry – I had to snigger because the Naugler’s wanted to go viral AND of course herpes is forever (viral!). Even chicken pox is forever and of course, it’s a form of herpes (herpes zoster).

    “verbal and mental abuse is worse than physical abuse.”

    Too true. It’s why I strongly advised my kids and their friends to at least try to AUDIT an Abnormal Psychology class if at all possible. Borrow the books, get chummy with a psych major and use what you learn while dating. Know when to broom someone to the curb and remember it’s best to do it early on before you get caught up in an undertow of crazy.

    Not only would it be best for the kids to leave the family compound, it would be to their benefit and to their future families’ benefit to sort out their upbringing and take stock of the good, bad and indifferent things they learned. Not everything has been bad even now, but it hasn’t been really good either. Issues tend to bubble up in your 30’s and most particularly if you’re a parent. Can’t keep it down forever and it will have an impact on your life and those around you.

    Hopefully Joe has taken the time to give them similar advice. He has an associate’s degree and wanted to counsel others (I think). His textbooks are outdated but they’re not completely obsolete for some basics.

  59. Rereading Mrs. Naugler’s comments, I was boggled all over again by her assertion that “[b]est laid plans would have given me raw land, but […] there is a septic and a well or cistern.”

    But.

    She really, seriously thought that moving to “raw land” with a deadbeat husband and a bunch of little kids would have been a good idea?!

  60. “The parents produced them and see them as their property and will never let them go. Mrs has even made comments to that effect when she post about the older boys having their own place to live in at the compound.”
    – – – – – – – – – – – – – – – – – –

    Oh, I think she’d let them go. The older ones, at least (If they started to get in the way). Soon, those boys will be full-grown men – whose needs are very much different from small children – living and sleeping in that shed with said small children and no outside social-interaction otherwise? It is not appropriate; its scary.

    Who knows the “sexual-education” they do or do-not receive! God-forbid, its under the guise of the teachings of LDS.

    Mrs. Naugler acknowledging that soon she may see the older boys having a shed of their own, is almost a good sign here. At least, for the first time ever, she recognizes the need – the human right – to privacy. OH, she knows! every one of her kids need privacy, but she is too stubborn to otherwise admit it outside of a slip in tongue, lest it make her go back on her claim that her children LOVE to sleep in a “dog-pile”.

    She likes(?) that the oldest boy can spend the day with the youngest girl, something that wouldn’t happen in an otherwise public schooling situation… There is a reason why educators and responsible adults dont pair up solitary seventeen year-old boys with young girls for purposes of education, or even to sleep together at night among the rafters in a dog-pile of others. Big NO.

  61. @Prolapsed Ovaries – I wonder if she ever read any of V.C. Andrews’ “Flower in the Attic” series. That woman was the Queen of Sick, Unhappy, Dysfunctional families!

    Anyway, my point is that Nicole may be unaware of how twisted the dynamic she has put into motion. Joe, with his AD in Psychology shouldn’t be and if he’s the parent who is teaching the children, then he should be particularly aware of the pitfalls.

  62. I can’t find the post where someone insisted that there was nothing that couldn’t be fixed by simply boiling the water that comes out of the pond and skimming off any floaters. It may have been on a FB page. Clearly the author reads this blog.

    You don’t have a clue. There are contaminants that could be coming out of that pond (or running off of a roof) that simply skimming off the obvious detritus and then boiling water will fix.

    Here is a short list:

    Lead
    Arsenic
    Copper
    Nitrates
    Radon
    Cytotoxic drugs

    The Naugler’s really need to send water samples in to be tested if they’re going to continue to subject their animals and possibly themselves; presuming they follow your advice author whose name I have forgotten.

  63. I forgot about radionuclides. They do occur naturally and some can be removed with proper filters, others cannot. Again, a good reason to send water samples off to be tested if they’re collecting water from the pond, or using rainwater. Rainwater can contain a lot of impurities itself and boiling doesn’t remove all of them.

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