Sovereignty

call it

Nicole is having thoughts late at night, apparently.  Maybe it’s from all that cleaning.  She’s tired and reflective.

The first part of this is a big whine about how overwhelmed she was when their story went viral.  It totally wasn’t her own doing or anything. It just happened. They were hanging out, just being normal, and wham!  Viral.

The problem with that is that some of the most god-awful photos of the shitshack and surroundings were taken by a professional news photographer.  You know, from the media. The media that Joe and Nicole invited to come to the shitshack and witness the awfulness of what the state was doing them, so their story would go. . . you guessed it. . . viral.

So pardon me if I just don’t start playing a mournful sympathy tune when she whines about how unprepared she was for notoriety.

But this part gets to me.

I can choose homebirth and you can choose a hospital birth and we can still get along.

Isn’t that nice?  It’s all tolerant and friendship-like. No reason for any quarreling or disagreement. Just use the opportunity to ask questions. Maybe you’ll learn something (implied: you stupid, ignorant dumbass). Nicole, of course, doesn’t need to ask any questions unless they are geared to box her opponent into a corner so she can deliver a resounding blow to the jaw.

Spend ten minutes reading a thread following some controversial shit she posts and you’ll see what I mean. There is no reasonable discussion. Disagree with her and you’ll be banned forthwith. Tell her you plan to circumcise your infant son and watch how tolerant she is.

But regardless of the fact that she doesn’t even know how to begin implementing the sentiment she wrote above, the basic idea is okay. All of us (I hope) have friends or family with whom we disagree from time to time. My closest friends in the world (apart from Dave) are Republicans. It gives me pain, and I am happy that they are unhappy Republicans who aren’t going to vote for Trump, but they are Republicans nonetheless. It’s not a deal-breaker when it comes to love.

But some things just aren’t open for negotiation, and where we draw the line is a very personal thing.

For me, racism is a biggie.  Make a racist joke in my presence and you’ll probably never say anything in my presence ever again.  Religion will also drive me over the edge.  It’s all fine as long as nobody tries to proselytize me. But start with crap about how you’re concerned about my “everlasting soul” and we are going to part company rapidly.

Those two things might not bother you.

But back to Nicole. The three things she mentions are unschooling, off-grid life, and stay-at-home dads.

She isn’t actually participating in any of those three things at all.

Her children aren’t “unschooled.” They simply are not educated at all.  Period. Nothing educational is done for or with them, and making a box doesn’t count.

I was a homeschooler.  I understand the concept of unschooling.  I even empathize a bit. I also understand with a whole lot of hindsight what the weaknesses and pitfalls are. Homeschooling, be it conventional or the unschooling variety, is not nothing.  It takes work and attention on the part of the parents to make it optimal.

The Nauglers are not “off-grid.”

They are squatters living without utilities in a garden shed. They depend totally on water from a source off their land, on food from sources off their land, on power from sources off their land except for the tiny bit of juice they generate with two small solar panels. Take away their off-the-land resources and they would all be dead in two weeks for sure and probably sooner than that.

And Joe Naugler is not a “stay-at-home dad.”

He’s an unemployed lazy-ass moocher, and for years he’s been mooching off his wife and anything the public gets conned into giving him.  I have been a stay-at-home mom, and I assure you, it’s not like what he does.

Just saying you’re unschooling, or living off-grid, or living in a cabin, doesn’t mean you actually are doing any of those things. Words have meanings, and we assign those meanings so we can communicate.

Haven’t I already talked about this before? Ah yes, I have.  Remember the camel?

camelI know, it’s idiotic, but he’s awfully cute.

trans slam

. . . others cannot define who we are.

Yes, we can.

The slam at Caitlyn Jenner is uncalled-for and pretty close to a racist joke in terms of how offensive I find it. There is an enormous difference between being trans (something Jenner cannot help and cannot change, like having red hair or bad teeth), and pretending you’re a “homesteader” when you’re really a squatter in a garden shed. The two things are not even remotely similar.

We are all sovereign beings.

sovereign

Are we?  Really?

Am I a queen, a supreme ruler?  I don’t think so.  Do I possess supreme or ultimate power? Nope.  (And obviously, I am not a coin.)

Neither does Nicole or Joe Naugler.

None of us do.

Nicole gets this nonsense from the so-called “sovereign citizen” movement.

sovereign citizens
click image to link to source

That’s from the FBI’s website. I assumed that would be an okay source to use, since one of the Blessed Little Plans is to have a sit-down conversation with the FBI.

None of us are “sovereign,” with the exception of a very few actual monarchs and most of them no longer have absolute power in their countries.

And Joe and Nicole are not exceptions to that, as they had very clearly laid out for them in court just the other day.  How many times do the authorities have to drag their asses in there before they start to get the message that they cannot just do whatever they like?

Coupled with all this is the idea that you can become anything you want if  you want it badly enough.

be anything

Well, no, a bear cannot become a frog.  I cannot just say I am an FBI investigator and suddenly be one.  Being “confident in who we are” does not mean being delusional about our capabilities or possibilities.  It doesn’t mean that you say you are a homesteader when you don’t meet a single one of the criteria that define that term.

And then she veers off topic to that of criticism, which is of course, always unfair when directed at her, and totally understandable when emanating from her.

If your ideas have merit, they will be adopted voluntarily. If they have to be forced, well, there’s a good reason why. They probably aren’t good ideas to begin with.

This is called argumentum ad populum. It’s a logical fallacy but one that is widely believed. If lots of people think something (Monsanto is evil, vaccines are dangerous, Jesus is real, prayer works, Trump would make a good president), then that has to be true.

No, it doesn’t.

If we’d waited for the argumentum ad populum, the descendants of slaves would be enslaved still, women would still not have the vote, and gays would not have the right to marry.

But let’s assume it’s true for a second.  If living in a garden shed, crammed in with 13 people and no utilities is a good thing, if doing nothing whatever about education but letting kids just run around doing whatever the hell they want all day long, if begging for money on the internet, if having children you simply cannot afford to educate, feed, clothe and house—if these are all good ideas that have “merit,” well, then why isn’t everyone else doing that?

What just astonishes me, and makes me more than a little bit sad, is that as of right now, four people read that little essay of Nicole’s and thought it was great.

 

94 thoughts on “Sovereignty”

  1. One reason these ideas are so attractive to people like Joe and Nicole is that they are, by definition, individualistic. These are people who pride themselves in not giving a crap what others think, feel, or experience. What better ‘movement’ to be a part of than one which defines each individual as “sovereign”. Feels good to imagine oneself a supreme ruler of one’s domain. It’s much more work to consider the needs of your children, fellow citizens, community members, and the world outside your bubble. The unparenting, unschooling, uncooking, and unworking all fit very neatly into this philosophy. It’s nothing if not consistent. Consistently self-centered, privileged, and backward.

  2. It’s much more than individualistic. I think it is spoiled, entitled, and privileged. They derive the benefits of our society without wanting to or giving back. They want most everyone else to follow those very rules they eschew, while not having to follow any themselves. They couch it in terms such as sovereign citizen, Voluntaryist, libertarian, anarchocapitalist without really having any understanding of what those terms mean for everyone. The same goes for free range, off grid, homestead, self sufficient or any other trendy term they can use for their own purposes. What it really boils down to is that they expect others to fund their “unconventional lifestyle”. The only thing unconventional about them is that they are antisocial bullies, with probable mental illness, who pollute the land they live on, take advantage of neighbors both around their home and around their business, and are general failures in everything they half heartedly attempt. They are takers who give nothing but false and empty words in return. In their case unconventional really means “we do what we want, when we want, and fuck everyone else (including their children) because they are lesser than us and they owe us.

  3. So suddenly she can get along with people that live differently that her?! What a f&^%ing joke! This woman has called people statists. She’s called people slaves for having jobs, having their homes hooked up to the grid, putting their children in public school and a host of other things. She is constantly degrading anyone whose views are different than hers. She belittles people. She is rude.

    And lets get to Joe, the stay-at-home dad. I know a little about being a stay at home parent. I’ve been one for 20+ years. Now that my children are older and I don’t have as many at home I will admit I have a little more time for myself. But when I had children under the age of 8 I rarely sat down. I was on the go constantly. There was always something to clean, always someone to tend to. I have half the children the Naugs have, still a large family but not quite as large. It is obvious Joe doesn’t do crap. He gives stay-at-home parents a bad time. I have no issues with stay-at-home dads, I know three. They are all amazing parents who tend to their homes and their children. They have littles so they rarely have time to do much, let alone post on Facebook. When you have small children sitting around is a luxury that doesn’t occur too often.

    Nicole needs to get real. She can blab all she wants about her life and what she thinks it is but it doesn’t make it so. She isn’t a homesteader, her shed is a shed, and she doesn’t get along with people. That’s reality.

  4. Spin spin spin
    You turn my head right round right round…

    She questions anyone who doesn’t agree with her 100%.

  5. “They are squatters living without utilities in a garden shed. They depend totally on water from a source off their land, on food from sources off their land, on power from sources off their land except for the tiny bit of juice they generate with two small solar panels. Take away their off-the-land resources and they would all be dead in two weeks for sure and probably sooner than that.”

    This paragraph should have a permanent spot on the side of this blog.

  6. My Dad was a very smart man. One that often did not have much to say but when he did you listened. He would come out with something now and then that made you stand up and take notice. He was also a very giving man a volunteer fireman for over 4 decades and over 2 decades on the volunteer ambulance squad. He was also the guy that every one came to for help to fix every thing and any thing because he could. He was a self taught man graduated high school but that was it every thing else he knew he taught himself.

    Dad did have one saying that pertains to Nicole and Joe very well –
    “They are a waste of good oxygen.” It does not mean that they are a waste to be talking about instead they are using up good oxygen that others could be using to sustain their lives. So Nicole and Joe stop breathing!

  7. Better yet how would they survive if their phones/computers broke and their internet went down? The visual is rather comical.

  8. Nicole and Joe, the determined dissenters from society, cannot live honestly or peacefully. They have demonstrated that incapacity in every state and every Kentucky county they have lived in. They spin and scam for cash. They harass their neighbors, any benefactors they’ve ever had who tried to help them ‘up’, anyone who expresses the mildest concerns over their decisions for the sake of their children, and even tax-paying citizens who drive down the public road that goes by the property they live on. They are as near as anyone I’ve ever seen to being perpetually vacillating between toddlerhood and self-absorbed teenagers. Frankly, that is somewhat insulting to many toddlers and many teenagers who have, in comparison to Nicole and Joe, demonstrated excellent judgment and wisdom.

    The whining, erratic, and contemptible Naugler parents despise the law. The very laws that they would do away with, that would allow them to openly and boldly harass and steal from others weaker than them, are the laws that ultimately protect them and the rest of us. The law also binds its enforcers to the commission of enforcing the law and not ad hoc law. The Naugler parents always bellyache for the protection of the law but hate it because they are, no matter what their stupid rhetoric, beholden to the law and responsible to abide by it.

    But, in their petulant demands for freedom from the law, rather than freedom of the law, they have broken it. Now their once considerable freedom has been curtailed by legal consequences. I, the non-sovereign (British sovereign coin, queen, no?) slave to the state, not only get to enjoy many material pleasures and comforts that are available when one qualifies and works for a good living, but I have considerable lawful freedom as well. In fact I have more freedom than the (let’s style this reasonably, shall we?) king and queen, Royal Sovereigns of the Blasted Little Not-A-State of Poopistan.

  9. So Nicole and Joe stop breathing!

    Careful here. I am going to assume you are speaking tongue-in-cheek. Nobody wishes anything like death on the any of the Nauglers.

  10. A statement that intrigues me, “If Bruce Jenner can identify as a woman, I can identify as a homesteader. All joking aside, we need to be confident in who we are. Be true to ourselves.”

    I sense several mixed messages here. It’s humoring to joke, that Bruce Jenner identifies as a woman? So outlandish that he “can”? Because he is a man. Only he identifies as a woman. And if he can, therefore so can Nicole also identify as a homesteader. That’s not copasetic. Nor funny. But yeah, Nicole as a homesteader, is a little outlandish.

    “Be true to ourselves.” My psychological bling is this. Being true to oneself is when your internal compass is aligned with your most genuine intentions. Intentions as in actions and behaviors.

    Acting the part, is not genuine intentions. Nor is it being true. No matter if you identify yourself as such.

    I’ve said this before, in previous chapters of this ongoing story. It parallels so much to a Hans Christian Andersen tale, The Emperor Has New Clothes. I hear the little boy as he cried out, “the Emperor has no clothes!” It is an often coined expression used when people believe something is untrue, a falsehood.

  11. Very stimulating commentary here!

    Well spoken Sculder&Mully. Indeed.

    And thank you, Sally, for another enjoyable evening read…

  12. Poor, poor N doesn’t know the difference between ideology and laziness or ambition and apathy. She fails to see that we are well aware of her lack of both ideology and ambition. For instance, I have nothing against women who have their babies at home; in fact, a few years ago, I assisted with a home birth myself. Usually, though, it’s always a good idea to have clean linens on the bed and to have a clean room that the baby is going to be born into. I don’t buy the home birth as an option for her just because she is making that choice based on the health of the infant or herself…she even posted the cost; it’s like Joe the stay at home parent is a stay at home parent because he is so domestic and nurturing; or they dump shit on the ground because they want to compost; or they steal water because it’s much nicer than…. All of their choices are not the results of their beliefs or convictions but are results of their lack of fortitude to do better….shit in a bucket and dump because Joe is too fucking lazy to dig a shit hole; no running water or septic because they spent their money on cool things like iPhones for J and N and iPads for J and N but nothing else…..she home births because they have no insurance, and, I believe, she cannot be bothered with monthly appointments with an OB. Their choices are a result of their only option and not because they have some heavy convictions…..N needs to be truthful….
    Sally, I’m with you: I can tolerate a republican; I can tolerate a religious nut; I cannot tolerate a homophobe, racists, misogynists, or a denier of children’s rights…. Her comment about Caitlyn Jenner shows how tolerant she is….what a liar.

  13. Clueless detective, you bring up a good point. I can not imagine that their neighbors would be jumping at the chance to haul water for this family after the way the Naugs have showed their rears in the community and on the net.

    They have bitten the proverbial hand that feeds them too many times. Hopefully their leghumpers are willing to do more than blow smoke if this situation ever comes to pass.

  14. #sendsnacks definiton of sovereign citizens is a very good one. I am not sure I would include libertarian in there as I know many and they do not necessarily eschew rules and laws and recognize the need for things like taxes to pay for infrastructures.
    As I mentioned before, hubby and I were harassed in every way possible by a Sovereign Citizen named Schaeffer Cox and his band of merry minions so I am very familiar with the belief system of these dregs. It went so far as to have the Troopers put up security cameras on our property out of concern for our safety. We were advised to have an exit plan from our home, to have a safe place we could hide and to be armed at all times. Schaeffer is now doing a miserable 26 years in a federal CMU prison and frankly I hope he rots.
    It all started because my husband checked on our crazy neighbor. There was an alarm going off at his place and when hubby went over to see if said neighbor was ok, my husband had a gun pointed to his head. After a 4 hour stand off the neighbor was arrested.
    We had to do a lot of learning about Sovereign Citizens just for our own safety and sanity. And truthfully, they are as looney as they come. I don’t wholeheartedly trust the government and no citizen should, however I don’t feel the need to put on my tin foil hat when I leave my house every morning.
    I found it highly amusing that Schaeffer eschewed the court system and made a couple of videos as he read statements in court and yet he used that same system to attempt to sue us twice. The lawsuits were frivolous but we still had to answer them and we racked up close to $40,000 in legal fees. That would have ruined us financially had it not been for a high priced attorney who took on our case pro bono simply because he hates bullies.
    Joe and Nicole aren’t true Sovereigns…..they really are too stupid to be so. Many of the Sovereigns we had the unfortunate circumstance to meet were quite intelligent but very misguided. The Nauglers like to throw around words and catch phrases but I’d bet an organ they could not tell you the history of the Sovereign Citizen movement, the major players or the foundational theories.
    Joe and Nicole are more akin to opportunistic grifters. Snake oil salesmen. And sadly the children are stuck in the insanity.

  15. [For your consideration: My post contains dead-pan humor, and dark humor. Leave the pearl necklace at home.]

    They are squatters living without utilities in a garden shed. They depend totally on water from a source off their land, on food from sources off their land, on power from sources off their land except for the tiny bit of juice they generate with two small solar panels. Take away their off-the-land resources and they would all be dead in two weeks for sure and probably sooner than that.”

    “This paragraph should have a permanent spot on the side of this blog.” (m)

    – – “I have to wonder how they would survive if their car broke down.” (Clueless Detective)

    They could survive. Weeks, a month, even. That is, everyone but Joe. Too much dead weight… Finally Joe can make a selfless sacrifice, finally he can be remembered for doing everything he could to feed his homeless family! God bless him.

    Okay, maybe there IS hope for Joe, but in a new role – the Blessed Little Homestead Truffle-Hog? After all, he does know where to find those saturated fats. He comes whenever Nicole calls. And no lessons needed – he already naturally bathes in his own filth. But ugh! If only he had the smart, sentient, emotional-intelligence found in normal swine!

    Which begs the question, how much does Joe weigh – can you sell him by the pound? And is it too late to enter a prize hog, into show at the State Fair? His family could sure use that prize money. Unless you’re fattening up for best-in-show, or for slaughter… Get to work, Joe! Your children depend on you to feed, clothe, and educate them- WAKE-UP Joe Naugler!

  16. My post was fairly crude. I apologize, everyone! It started with one sentence. It’s all I wanted to write. One dark, wry sentence. Simple. Funny. Oh but I ruined it! Oops.

  17. Well, I wrestled with this for a bit. I really hate to make jokes about cannibalism. But I’m not sure why I feel that way and suspect it’s not exactly rational or even fair to say “no cannibal jokes” when we make lots of other jokes equally “shitty.” So I’m allowing it.

    Moderation is hard work sometimes. I have to do some serious thinking. 🙂

  18. Joe Bloom says:
    August 30, 2016 at 9:22 pm
    Better yet how would they survive if their phones/computers broke and their internet went down?

    This is what probably would truly send the Nog’s in the psychiatric unit at the nearest hospital. Not joking here at all! Losing the ability to communicate through social media would send both of them over the edge. It is their whole world.

  19. Peg,

    That was a definition of the Nauglers. Not a definition of Libertarians. Libertarian or any other cloak the Nauglers choose to hide under is just another philosophy, political group, religion, fad or whatever that the Nauglers cherry pick memes (not really ideas as that is too much work for them) from to justify their own failures and inability to be even marginal human beings.

    While I am not a libertarian I certainly believe we need an extreme overhaul of both the tax system and better oversight and control of government spending.

  20. I also think it’s quiet telling in that same post, she laments that her FB page went from 2-3 thousand friends (as if) to 45000 (also as if) and she was so bombarded. I really think the mention of how many followed her on FB is self indulgent and meant to do a little bragging in response to Sally’s most recent accounting of this blog’s popularity. N doesn’t write or do anything without the subtext of her proclaiming “How Great She Is” and even in those moments when she is really trying to cloud her message with homespun, the true message comes through loud and clear. Even her example of her son’s little box project that comes as a means for her to show how wonderful unschooling is and how much he is demonstrating his knowledge (yeah, my son, when he was like in 7th grade made little boxes in shop class too and he learned how to make a finish like mahogany), the subtext is that they will be for sale real soon. I wonder if he wrote an essay about the importance of proletariat skills versus academic knowledge or I wonder if he demonstrated his technical writing knowledge by writing instructions for creating the little box? Who knows…..anyway, when I read her updates or posts….and then I read the three or four who love and worship her (her little sneaky faux accounts), I wonder how silly she is to think anyone buys her shit.

  21. Nicole is such a sad sack. She tries in vain to make her story something special. Like she is the pioneer of alternative living but the truth is she is a co-dependant woman trapped in a bad situation of her on making.

    When she was young, naive and still thought love would conquer all, when she made the mistake of believing Joe would be the man to help her get away from her family, she lost her freedom right then and there.

    From that very fateful moment that she met Joe, she has had to carry him on her back. She gave up her education, her ambitions and a ton of common sense. Just when you think there was not any further down that rabbit hole she could go with that loser she loses her freedom, literally, by ending up in the slammer.

    The only difference between her jail and that of an inmate is the lack of bars. She has no real freedom of movement, no real choices, very few options and certainly no ability to climb out of poverty. Freedom is what she wishes to think she has but that certainly is not the reality. She is a woman dragged down to her knees for the love of a useless schmuck. I could care less that she is in that position if it was only herself, but she tangles 11 innocent kids into her mess.

    When are you going to find the courage to step out on your own and free your kids and yourself of the ever increasing burden that is Joe? IMO ditching Joe is your best bet.

  22. oops that should read – Like she is the pioneer of alternative living but the truth is she is a co-dependant woman trapped in a bad situation of her OWN making.

  23. I just saw her crying her crocodile tears on her vlog. Looks like cps is of the same opinion as me. Dotch Joe so you are better off. Joe, in my opinion is why this family is in such dire straights.

  24. I hope that the four people who read that blog and thought it was great were: Joe, Nicole, and two of their socks.

    All my life, I have wished that I had even a halfway decent singing voice. Alas, I am truly tone deaf and can barely make it through a chorus of Happy Birthday to You without every dog within a 50-yard radius starting to howl. My family and loved ones understand and pretend it’s not awful. In return, other than the Happy Birthday song, I only sing in the car when I’m alone, windows rolled up. I live in a reality-based world and accept that no matter how much I try, or want it to be, I can’t carry a tune.

    What Joe and Nicole willfully refuse to recognize is that their actions affect more than the two of them. First, their actions directly impact every single one of their children. They are choosing to make their lives more difficult by not educating them (and the blame will fall on the children for not unschooling themselves properly no doubt), by likely providing poor nutrition during their formative years, by isolating them from the rest of the community, and by not getting birth certificates and SS numbers for them. When they reach adulthood, each one will have to deal with a lot of red tape and headaches trying to obtain those two necessary documents.

    Second, their actions affect the neighbors whose properties adjoin theirs. From stealing water and threatening that neighbor with a gun, to letting their livestock run loose and onto neighbors’ property, to dumping their human waste and allowing the run-off to possibly polluting the water supply of surrounding properties, to generally being unpleasant to deal with — the list goes on and on.

    I wonder if Nicole ever has a glint of harsh reality – where she realizes that Joe is nothing but a big weight around her neck, dragging her down with him? He contributes nothing to the family resources: he doesn’t bring in any income, he doesn’t seem to know the least little thing about construction, homesteading, gardening, auto repair, homeschooling, animal husbandry. In short, he doesn’t seem to know anything or do anything, besides look forward to a fast food meal out with his wife on court days. A smarter woman would have realized long ago that he’s not worth the effort and moved on to greener pastures.

  25. I agree that if the car breaks down then things will get very bad very quickly. No work for N. Mo way to get gas for the generator. And the biggie–no water. I’m sure they don’t have much water stockpiled. They would be able to eat canned goods for quite awhile, but water is needed every day. That would be a true child welfare emergency. I hope.

  26. Sally, I am wondering if you have any info on what the law is in KY. about a concield carry permit.I know were I live the FBI did an extensive background check on me & I was not alowed to have a criminal record.Are people with criminal records alowed to own guns or be in the presence of peope with guns in KY?

  27. The discussion of how screwed the N’s would be if their car broke down got me thinking more about their location. It really couldn’t be much worse for a family of limited means. I live in a suburb, the kind of place Nicole would probably say mean things about.

    But get this: I live within 1.5 miles of several grocery and convenience stores and a Walmart, within 2-3 miles of all the schools, the library, the bank, several playgrounds, Dr’s office, and an urgent care, etc, etc…literally anywhere I need to go, I can walk or ride my bike. Most places are connected by sidewalks, a bike path, or quiet streets. I can even ride my bike to a well regarded state college. Although we do have two vehicles, if I sold mine tomorrow, it wouldn’t be super convenient but I could meet my family’s needs. And cost of living is pretty good, you can get a 4 bedroom house needing cosmetic updates for about $150k (with reasonable tax rates). Stupid conformist suburbs :P.

    Seriously though, wouldn’t that be so much better for her family? I think their chosen location is just another sign of the mental illness/disordered thinking that they suffer from.

    And ironically, in my slightly less than 2 acre suburban plot, I think I might be as close (or closer) to homesteading than J&N are. Our set-up is geared much more towards emergency preparedness rather than living off grid continuously, but I still think that push come to shove, we would be less reliant on the outside world than J&N. We have 15 laying hens and have maintained the flock for six years. We are able to meet the needs of several families with these birds. We have the know how and equipment to raise birds for meat if we needed to do so. I have a productive garden and use cold frames to extend my growing season.

    We have city water but have maintained our well from the days before city water, so we have water if the city supply went down. We have a supply of filters to use in that situation as well. We also have a rain barrel system. When we remodeled our “not a cool homestead” suburban house, we installed a wood burning fireplace insert so we can heat our home without electricity or gas. My husband has chopped and properly stored about 6 cords of wood, and barters with a friend for wood for eggs since we don’t want to take down any more of our trees. The only thing we are really missing is our own source of electricity, and I think we’ll add something in the next few years. We don’t want to be homesteaders, or live like homesteaders – but then again, I don’t know that J&N want to either. They must not, or surely they’d be farther along than we are, living in the suburbs with two more than full time jobs.

  28. “M” says that “Losing the ability to communicate (THROUGH) social media” would send both of them over the edge .”

    I think, in fact, you meant…..”Losing the ability to communicate (AT) social media” would send both of them over the edge.”

    Right? There, fixed that for you. 🙂

  29. Her son did a good job on the box. In our little town, at his age, he could attend half day at tech for free as a high school student and learn construction. The construction class here teaches them all the aspects of building a house. Wiring, plumbing, framing, etc. It’s a two year program that is free for high school students, even homeschoolers.

    She is keeping him in a box. He could have so much more.

    The free class would open a whole world for him. But she can’t allow that, sadly.

    Tech Construction Class
    Career Opportunities:
    Entry level in all phases of construction to work toward their journeyman’s licenses
    Post Secondary Construction Management or construction background to enter into engineering

    Certifications:
    Work Keys
    Construction Trainee
    NCCER Core Curriculum
    NCCER Level One Certification: Carpentry, Electricity, Plumbing, & HVAC

  30. I don’t want to take away from [child’s name] initiative. It’s great that the kids seem to have something their father completely lacks and their mother barely possesses. It takes a huge amount of inner strength and conviction to show initiative when the adult examples in your life pretty much exclusively model inertia. However, my kids make boxes in wood shop class at public school in grade 7. By his age, as Bea mentioned above , those who are inspired to continue with carpentry are building houses. Of course [child’s name] can choose to learn and he’d be at the same level as those his age in his early twenties. It’s not a lost cause by any means. He can do it in spite of his neglectful parents, not because of them. It’s a shame that they are putting up more barriers for their kids to have to overcome if they want to just do normal things in life and have normal jobs.

  31. @Magenta: It’s part of growing up with narcissistic parents. The most ordinary things require humongous elaborate workarounds, if they’re attainable at all. If there were a free carpentry class in Breck County, and [child’s name] had even heard about it in the first place, they would have to deal with:

    *Dad’s disinclination to do anything, ever.
    *Mom’s knee-jerk opposition to anybody who appears to be better than her at anything at all.
    *Both parents’ disinclination to let their kids go if there’s a way to use them for narcissistic supply or material gain.
    *Being the kind of (per on-site reports) smelly, unsocialized kid who experiences bus rides to school as the lone fish in a barrel of bullies.
    *Having parents who don’t even believe in giving kids Craigslist beater bikes.
    *Having zero local support network, therefore no way to barter for a ride.
    *Also zero or near-zero ability to earn money–and I bet that money the kids do earn is all siphoned off by the parents.
    *And probably no shoes or outer gear appropriate for bad weather if they do the heroic thing and start walking at a ridiculously early hour in order to get to the class.

    Whereas, a couple of dirt-poor parents who weren’t massive narcissists would most likely say, “OK, this sounds like a way to help you become a self-supporting independent adult and hey it’s free” and handwash the kid’s clothes in a white bucket if that was what it took to get him ready for the bus.

  32. And yes, I actually am calling the two of them narcissists now. Because if someone talks like a narcissist, and acts in predictably narcissistic ways, and poops all over other people’s lives like a narcissist…then they effectively are.

  33. Great comment, Bea!
    Although “[he] did a good job on the box”… Indeed, “[Nicole is the one] keeping him in a box”!!

    Look. Realistically, obtaining an AA in Construction Technology or Welding would be difficult considering the ELM and EPT, or equivalent assessments, and consequent remedial classes.
    BUT!
    There are still accessible and short – albeit valuable – programs of certification! Considering the below-poverty-level parental income, all classes would likely be paid for by the Board of Governor’s Waiver, or another readily available financial-aid program (there are many!).

    At the local Community College and Technical School in Elizabethtown, they offer;
    Certificate of Basic Carpenter
    Drywaller Certificate
    Carpentry Helper Certificate

    Considering his youth, and interest level… Any of those certificates would take this young man miles above his father’s life-earnings, very quickly! He could do – and I am sure – will do, better than that pathetic sack of shit regardless.

  34. One more thought, humor me please. (And thank-you to whomever actually reads my comment!)

    Teenagers are very perceptive!
    I know- I can see it in their condescending glares and head-tilts toward the camera- that they can see that their parents are “off”. Sure, most teenagers are annoyed by their embarrassing parents. But I think, while these particular teenagers love their parents, they also understand that they are uniquely more ill-tempered than the rest. They probably have a lot of existential thoughts, like many teenagers do, that perhaps they were dealt a hard hand. Surely they have the desire and drive to – they probably even dream of – doing better than their parents, but are just waiting for time and fate to work itself out, so that they can mature to the point and opportunity of actually being able to do something about it.

    What I wonder is, what would their motivation behind wanting to succeed be? With parents as narcissistic and self-serving as Joe & Nicole, how difficult is it to grow up and NOT be just as narcissistic?! …Are they more worried about wanting to succeed, to take better care of their parents and siblings… Or are they more concerned with just wanting to take better care of themselves? I think there will be some of the latter, but more of the former (positive motivation for helping their family).

    ::the end of my spiel::
    ::yay::

  35. OMG…what happened last night? I was like a teenage girl whose boyfriend wouldn’t pick up the phone! I was a pathetic mess thinking it was over.
    Glad your back up

  36. If I had that skill set..I’d build myself my own little house, just for me…my own room,my own bed, my own closet..mine.

  37. OMG…what happened last night?

    The site was down briefly. I have no idea why. I was too tired to care and it fixed itself. 🙂

    UPDATE: There are still intermittent issues. I contacted the hosting service and they are aware and have engineers working on it. It’s not just this website. They have a problem someplace.

  38. To the Naugler boy who built the box from an old carpenter I know:

    “Your box looks nice. Cut off the sharp screws sticking inside the box and file them flat or they will tear the hell out of someone’s hand. Next time use shorter screws, and screw them from the inside out so they don’t show on the outside. Your stain looks nice. If you’re going to turn it into a business, you need to get and education in math, marketing and profit margins. Making it into a business is much harder than making the product. Find a shop or crew that will take you on as an helper or apprentice if you’re serious. Keep going.”
    From an old carpenter who loves to see a kid trying.

  39. FB Refugee,
    Great advice to the kid. I hope the older kids do read the things we write because they need to know that there is more…always more. Like you said, if he is going to make the boxes to sell, he needs to know to make them where they don’t scratch someone and how to market them and how to do the accounting. Unlike his mother who is selling bows and such with little or no thought into profit margins, he should at least take a look at how much it cost to make versus how much people are willing to pay…so he should go take a look at some of the retail shops around for similar but mass produced containers…look on line….maybe check at craft fairs. You know….get an idea.

  40. @Peg, are you a fellow Fairbanksan? I have to say, Schaeffer Cox is a perfect example of Alaskan libertarianism gone awry. What an awful human.

  41. I admit I’m not a baby expert. My daughter was almost two when I adopted her. I didn’t let her feed herself because we were working on attachment. Her diet was limited to soft moist foods due to some sensory issues. I always fed her in the highchair so she’d feel secure and to establish a routine. I never owned a pack and play. So sitting a child in a pack and play with a plate of food, is that a common thing? Her leghumpers think it’s wonderful but they also think her shed is a “cozy cabin.” Do babies normally eat lettuce and mushrooms?

  42. Who feeds a toddler lettuce .Onions, mushrooms??? Who wonders why the eyes are burning? Onions!!!!!!!! Why can’t a high chair be used, how degrading. She knew it would draw attention. The poor blog gets 10 comments a day…at the most.

  43. P. Ovaries, I read your comments and you’re welcome 😀

    I feel so out of the loop with Nauglerville, I need to get caught up on what I’ve missed. I’ve been super busy lately, I’m currently identifying as an Olympic hopeful for the Canadian Woman’s figure skating team so I’ve been practicing figure eights and pinteresting costume ideas.

  44. We have a pack-n-play. It’s used for my granddaughter to nap in. She feeds herself foods like noodles or PBJs for lunch at the table (I made portable fabric “high chairs” for her and her brother). She doesn’t do salad, since she only has 8 teeth; she’s 1 1/2. I don’t think it’s normal to let them eat where they sleep.

  45. Tori,
    No it is not. Most parents use a highchair, utensils, age appropriate foods, a bib, and constant supervision while eating with a ten month old child. I’m not claiming to be an expert, but I do have common sense. It was the daughter comforting the baby as the mother recorded it. I think the video shows how far gone or lack of judgment the mother has. I would be ashamed to make my child eat in a filthy pack n play, but it was displayed with pride. He was eating vegetables.

    Random rant:. All the supporter constantly praising must be off themselves or they just want to watch the show and see what she does next. Even before they went of grid and had rentals the background in the photos show filth. I’m not the best housekeeper, but you can see in the carefully cropped photos that they post the dirty walls and furniture. I’m bringing this up because, they were unable to maintain a rental property with all the utilities. The post I read was about organizing. I know if I was posting I would make sure my house looked tidy. I think that was Nicole’s tidy. If that is on the grid and now off the grid I’m just wondering now what the family looks like day to day. People usually post pictures they look best in. In all the current photos the kids as well as mom have dirty nails etc.. I’m thinking that those are the best she chooses to share.

  46. I personally would not feed my baby in a pack and play. It is just asking for funk and bacteria to grow in your playpen. That being said, it did appear to be reasonably clean (aside from the lunch mess). I read the page post on my phine so the photo was not large, but i did not notice and nasty obvious stains.

    I was also of the mind that my kids mainly ate whatever we served for dinner (barring any obvious choking hazards). Most cultures do not feed their infants special diets. Many pediatricians say that offering a variety of tastes and textures encourages children to be adventurous eaters. At the baby’s age he is still getting most of his nutrition from breastmilk or formula anyway.

  47. It seems that N has seen herself as a farmer and earth mother for some time. I believe that the name of her previous blog was “HomespunHarvest”. Does anyone know the back story of
    that period of time ?

    What has changed:

    + They lived in an actual house….you know, with four walls and doors. I think this is the time period (2010-2011) where they said that they closed off all the bedrooms and all slept in a (no doubt) filthy pile in the living room.
    * I believe that they had ****gasp**** indoor plumbing, a stove, refrigerator, etc.
    * Nicole seemed to actually and actively be homeschooling the 7 or 8 kids they had by then.
    *. The house looked tidy.
    *. *****double gasp****** It would seem that Joe was actually W O R K I N G at a job? There were a few inferences to new opportunities that would be waaaaay better, since the new opportunity always seemed to recognize the untapped genius and raw talent within Joe Naugler.

    What hasn’t changed :

    * It seems that they had the electricity turned off . (Or more likely, they got their power turned off for nonpayment .)
    * Nicole always seems to be a rebel looking for a cause. In those days, it seems that it was the leadership or bishop of their ward. Now, it’s that evil gubmint and us “slaves”.

    First of all, I am at a loss to explain the original URL……”HomespunHarvest”. What were they harvesting, besides the ever present shit ? (This is a serious question.)

    They then sort of disappeared for a bit; I am assuming that this was when they parted ways with the LDS ward? They then reappear with a new URL, living in garden shed #1 on the “BlessedLittleHomestead”, soon to be replaced by shitshack, to be replaced by garden shed #2.

    Oh, and the pallets are ever present as well, of course .

    Can anyone bridge this time period? The only thing I can come up with is that they lost the house after parting ways with the LDS ward, and it was a choice of squatting on “the virgin wilderness” in garden shed #1, OR being homeless, but that is an assumption on my part, and I don’t know if it is true.

    Thank you for any insight!

  48. We fed our 10 month old children most foods, but, this is a big but, either cooked and mashed or very finely sliced/diced pieces. Think raisin size (as in the developmental stage termed “regarding a raisin”). This excludes nuts as anything but puréed. A great lesson was learned when my 1 1/2 year old brother aspirated a peanut given to him by a stewardess and ended up in pediatric icu and surgery.

    We also introduced a single new food at a time so if there was an allergic reaction we could see what caused it, but that was erring on the side of caution since there are food allergies in the family.

  49. @ Tori
    When she posts about herself no one is interested, she’s boring and frankly unhinged, so one of her recycled themes frequently is dirty baby/child vids and pix used for drumming up controversy to feed her need for attention.

    I haven’t ever seen a baby this young interested in chopped lettuce or mushrooms as hers clearly wasn’t and of course most families use a highchair for obvious reasons. But remember this is the same woman who will post pix/vids of herself on all fours in childbirth for all the world to see and comment, all the while claiming to be a secretive introvert.
    It’s all about her insatiable need for constant attention/$$$ and putting on a show. Shock and controversy sells and she exploits her kids for this purpose. Narcissistic needs imo.

  50. So when does her nine year old ever play with kids her own age? When does she get to make friends and go to activities designed for kids her age?
    Once again Nicole thinks people should admire that her child is restricted to childcare, shop work and playing alone or with siblings her whole childhood.
    My kids are loving and take care of each other too. We spend most of the day together and they help do chores around the house. AND they also get to have time with friends, attend activities of their choosing and be homeschooled enough to get a college ready ACT score. Step up your game Nicole.

    I think Nicole just posts “baby eating salad” videos because she knows it will cause drama. I don’t really care if people feed their baby salad, he will either eat it or he will play with it. Plenty of people let their kids learn to eat real food by playing with it and learning to chew. It’s the nine year old I feel sorry for. She doesn’t know any other way of life. She doesn’t know how much easier it would be for him to eat and for her to clean up if he ate in a high chair. But she has been taught to just give him a plate of food in the play pen. Then she has to clean him and all that mess up. Can you imagine if Nicole hired a real baby sitter and told them to just put a plate of food on the floor or in the pen for him? What adult would want to clean that mess up everyday when they could just put him in a high chair?

  51. @Tori
    I too was bothered by the pack-n-play eating. I did have one for all of my boys, but it was just for naps at Grandma’s, at the beach or lakehouse, or I needed them off the floor so I could sweep up quickly because messes happen & you can’t always wait for them to go to sleep to clean up. My issue is that choking is a real thing for babies. Lettuce will mush up pretty good, but cucumbers? Onions? I was in no way a helicopter parent & my babies needed to feed themselves to learn about textures, develop their fine motor skills & learn independence. However I always sat by them. Choking can happen quickly & you need to react quickly. It’s not the very young daughters responsibility. Also not on any planet would I have let a 9 yr old watch my boys when they were this young. Not a knock on the little girl, but she’s not mature enough yet nor should she be! She’s 9 years old for goodness sake!!!!

  52. I did go back and watch the video again and the kids pants ARE filthy. I cant imagine that crawling around on the floor of a “dog salon” is the healthiest of enviroments.

  53. If this weren’t the Nauglers we were talking about, putting a kid in a Pack’n’Play with a plate of food wouldn’t be a big deal. When we gave our toddlers yogurt, we put them in the bathtub, because about half of it would end up on their exteriors. If the Pack’n’Play is washable, it’s a good place for a tot who loves to smear and rub food around to eat. Of course, it would have to actually get washed…

    As for lettuce and mushrooms, I had a baby who loved to share my salads. But he was also eating more substantial foods.

  54. I know that there are a lot of people who feed their babies peanut butter, but pediatricians recommend holding peanut butter out of infant and toddlers’ diets because of the propensity for humans to have allergic reactions to the peanut. Because I am one of those people who is deathly allergic to peanuts, I am always worried when it is served to children with seemingly little thought. Neither of my two kids were allergic to peanuts but four of my grandkids have the same deadly allergic reaction to peanuts as I….so, for her to give the baby the peanut butter in such a large amount without first doing a little testing just reinforces my belief that she lacks reasoning and foresight….Plus, you know, letting the baby eat in the place that looks like where he sleeps is dangerous and gross. Dangerous because what we see of their living quarters, N isn’t the cleanest person on the planet so I’m sure there are bits and pieces of food left in the bed for the baby to possibly eat later and maybe choke while they are all sleeping or not near him and gross because you know food in the bed…..smeared on the walls of the bed….just nasty and surely attracting ants, roaches, and maybe even rats: just how expected her to live.

  55. N posted that she pays the youngest daughter a dollar a day. She can earn 25 or 50 cents for each additional chore that she chooses to do. I think Patricia wrote that she makes the kids at the shop pay for their own lunch. I’m thinking that the little girl barely makes enough to pay for her food. Of course she shouldn’t be working there three days a week anyway, or be responsible for the baby.

  56. I know that there are a lot of people who feed their babies peanut butter, but pediatricians recommend holding peanut butter out of infant and toddlers’ diets because of the propensity for humans to have allergic reactions to the peanut.

    Not any more. That used to be their position, but newer research suggests that the earlier infants are introduced to peanut butter, the better. There is some evidence that suggests that because people have delayed feeding them, the allergy rate has gone up.

  57. When my child was 10 months old, he was eating some solid foods but not onions. I also sat next to him at the table, he in his high chair, and made sure all was well. Another reason for eating at the table was it was easy to clean up afterwards. Wipe my son’s face and hands, wipe the tray, sweep the floor. Easy peasy. I am so fried that she makes her children buy their own lunch. If she paid them a fair amount, that would be one thing. But $1 for an entire day of babysitting? Poor kid couldn’t even get a burger for that amount.

  58. I have a friend who first fed her child peanut butter in the hospital parking lot because the allergy runs in their family. I thought that was smart. (child was fine 🙂 )

    I cannot believe that people think it’s ok for a child to work part time for less than slave wages, not ever have the opportunity to socialise with her peer group, and not attend any sort of schooling (even homeschooling). I just cannot believe it. It makes me feel a rolling rage. Why the hell is CPS not intervening. It is unbelievably negligent of the parents. OMG I am so angry about this.

  59. “If this weren’t the Nauglers we were talking about, putting a kid in a Pack’n’Play with a plate of food wouldn’t be a big deal.”

    Have to disagree with that. Pretty sure most people would find feeding a child by putting his plate on the floor or floor of the playpen (like a dog) unnecessary and dirty and wasteful. Very young children shouldn’t be able to crawl or walk around when they eat.
    Even in countries with no high chairs or tables, the parents or an older child will hold the baby or sit next to them to feed them and make sure they sit still and don’t choke or spill and waste the food. Where do you ever see someone just put their baby on the floor, give them a plate of food and walk away?

  60. One of the most disturbing videos of Nicole’s is the one in which she demonstrates carrying a baby in a sling. She is extremely rough and inattentive to the baby’s fragile neck. It’s absolutely awful.
    Lots of the stuff she shows that people kinda nit-pick is fine to me. There are enough examples of egregious negligence that I think the nit-picky responses detract from the bigger picture.

  61. I know enough about babies, I’ve had a few. My kids never ate in a pack and play. They ate in high chairs, boosters or in my lap. My babies rarely ever ate baby food. I made sure to make food they could eat. If we had carrots, I made sure to cook some for them. When they were less than a year old they ate solid foods that were soft.

    The video of the baby made me so sad. I also finally watched the video Nicole made the other day. Both were really depressing. Depressing because there seems to be no hope. I don’t doubt she loves her kids, every mother does but she is in deep. She is obviously exhausted, she needs help, and the help isn’t coming from children raising their siblings. Those poor kids.

    I looked on her Facebook page today. I read the comments. This one hit me particularly hard. “It’s sad that people are so jealous of what a great mom you are, and how you demonstrate ”
    Nicole may love her kids but nothing she posts shows what a great mom she is. They show a mom trying to survive and being stubborn because she is ill or something. If she could let go of her pride, suck it up and get help those kids would be better off and it would help her. Actually using resources would go a long way in showing that she is a good mom, but right now the evidence is pointing to a women too stubborn to let go of her beliefs and the kids are suffering. None of us are jealous of her, there is absolutely nothing to be jealous of.

  62. I was most disturbed by her putting a plate of food in the child’s bed….it was smeared all over the blankets….who does that? Even if it is only the kid’s playpen, I have no reason to believe a sane mother would throw a plate of food to the child like they were some animal. Why would you allow food to be all over bedding and blankets? SO gross. Makes NO sense.

  63. A word of CAUTION about Peanut Butter and Choking Hazards.

    My cousin Christina had a 18 month old baby girl who died because of Peanut Butter. Christina and the father of the baby were divorced. He had every other weekend visits with his daughter. One weekend he feed her a Peanut Butter & Jelly Sandwich during her visit.
    He used Peanut Butter that had NUTS in it. She got choked just a little bit, he said that he gave her a drink of milk and all seemed good and well after that. ( But he never told Christina about the baby getting choked, until after the Autopsy Report came in.)

    A few days later after the visit with her Daddy, the baby’s chest seemed to be swelling and the baby was crying a lot. Christina took her baby to the Doctor’s office. The Doctor sent her over for testing at the hospital for X-Ray’s. They found some odd tissue swelling in her left lung. The hospital did not keep her and sent the baby home after making an appointment with a Lung Specialist.
    A few hours later the swelling had gotten so big the baby could barely breath. Christina rushed her back to the ER. While there the baby stopped breathing on them and went into a full Cardiac Arrest and the Emergency Doctor’s lost her.

    The State of Ohio did an Autopsy, the report basically stated that a ” Thin slice of a nut, with a single shape edge was embedded in the left side of the lung, causing it to swell, putting so much pressure on her heart, that the heart could not beat any longer.”

    I swear people, going to that baby’s funeral was one of the saddest thing’s I’ve ever seen or done in my life. Three weeks later, after the Autopsy Report came back her Daddy remembered the Peanut Butter & Jelly Sandwich he had feed her….he tried to comment suicide and was hospitalized for months.
    It really was not his felt, he loved his little girl dearly !!! He would have never done that had he known that would have happened.
    I mean who would have thought that something so simple would have caused a young life to be taken away so quickly?
    That could have happened to any of us….really who would have thought a PB & J ????
    But after our clan lost “Baby Jolene” my family and I stay away from anything with NUTS in it and we are very mindful of any Choking Hazard’s……….

    It is not just the “Allergic Reactions” parents need to be worried about….or just NUTS either.
    It’s large sized CHOCKING HAZARD’S as well.
    Which is why the “Naugler Baby” shown in the video should NOT have large pieces… of a left over ADULT SIZED CUTS of a salad… placed anywhere near the baby…let alone him it trying to EAT IT !!!

    Where is just a little “Common Sense” with these people?
    I swear, they are an accident just waiting to happen !!!!

    WAKE-UP…… C.P.S !!!!
    W-A-K-E ….. U-P 🙁

  64. A good article about choking hazards in small children other than her outdated caution about not exposing babies to peanuts. She’s basically cautioning about feeding infants nuts that are whole (correct), but then she says don’t feed them peanuts at all. Peanut butter (the smooth kind, of course) is fine and the latest research suggests that it is actually a good thing to do.

    Having said that, I think we all have to use a bit of common sense here. It’s very easy to nit-pick every photo and every video and criticize every teeny thing, and Nicole really likes it when people do that because it reinforces her idea that “everyone is picking on her.”

    She is not going to get the Mother-of-the-Year award, we all know that. In fact, didn’t the Nauglers get mentioned in a list of Worst Parents? She dumps her young kids on the older ones, except when she wants to use them for photo ops. And very often, the photo ops are designed to elicit praise from the leghumpers and criticism from the critics. She does this on purpose. She mentioned feeding the baby peanut butter knowing that it would cause controversy. None of this is accidental.

    Don’t fall for her games.

  65. You have been a bit quiet lately. No new blog posts?! Boo!! I guess it’s because she (N) has only been posting about her kids lately? And I know that you don’t like to talk about the kids. Thanks for posting some comments to read.

  66. I agree with everyone re: larger (salad size) pieces of food. My brother in law, when he was a boy, witnessed his five yr old neighbour choke to death on a grape. Repeat : A GRAPE. And yes, the parents were home, did Heimlich, called 911, everything they were supposed to. But, if the right sized piece slips into the esophagus, it can block the airway and there’s no getting it out. I’m of the belief that no one in this family would be likely to call for an ambulance or seek any medical attention as it would be an admission that they screwed up. And that doesn’t play to the Naugler narrative of how wonderful and knowledgeable they are. It’s only a matter of time before one or more of these children suffer a tragic illness or accident due to the mother’s bullshit ideology.

  67. Sally,

    My cousins baby Jolene died in 1985. Since that time there has been a lot of changes in research and development of new technology to diagnose and identify foreign objects in the body. Jolene’s death raised some awareness throughout the State of Ohio though news media reports at the time. Back in those days who would have thought a PB & J Sandwich would have caused such a thing? When it happened it was very shocking and devastating news for our family.
    But those days it seems to be pretty common occurrence according to the article’s you have posted and Lisa’s personal story of her little brother aspirating on peanuts.
    After reading both articles and reading Lisa’s story I’m thrilled that doctor’s and hospital staff are more aware and better equipped to handle such life threatening cases. It has been many years since I have read up on this.
    Thank’s…I learned something good today !!! 🙂

  68. You have been a bit quiet lately. No new blog posts?! Boo!!

    I am painting kitchen cabinets. The electrician (finally, we hope) is coming on Tuesday, so we are working around that, which makes it all sort of strange. I am working on a page, though. It just isn’t done.

  69. @Bea: *raises hand*

    I tried lap feeding, but kept dropping food on the baby’s head. High chair feeding active kids who had figured out that throwing their body weight around could sometimes get the things they were sitting on to move just terrified me–especially because our floors are tile, oh their fragile little skulls. And bolt-on high chairs were not an option because our dining table has a tippy tilty folding top. So my husband got a nice piece of oak and four pre-turned legs with brass feet and made a tiny table. Baby would crawl up to the table, hoist theirself up, plant their little bottom on a stool made from an old activity cube, and look up expectantly for their plate. When Baby was done, they got wiped off and crawled away to play. Bonus: I can’t recall any instances of food being launched toward the floor.

  70. It’s only a matter of time before one or more of these children suffer a tragic illness or accident due to the mother’s bullshit ideology.

    Yes, her ideology is bullshit. Lots of it. Stuff we haven’t even talked about yet.

    But people believed all sorts of strange, dumb things in the past and some of them managed to raised umpteen kids without any “tragic illness or accident.” I’m cautious about making dire predictions, because if they do not come to pass, then it looks like your concerns were completely without merit.

    She engages in a lots of risky behavior, yes. Is karma gonna bite her or her family as a result? I do not know.

  71. Oh, and for crawly babies who aren’t ready to pull themselves up to sit on something: At that age they’re mainly eating solids for fun anyway, so we would put something tasty in a mesh feeder and just hand it to the kid wherever they happened to be. (Not recommended for people who don’t have tile floors.)

  72. @Blessed Little Blogger: Your comment just popped up. The bullshit ideology that may well get one of those kids killed, IMO, is the parents being as stubborn as hogs on ice about immunizations. No, Mrs. Naugler, flowing blood does not remove tetanus bacilli from puncture wounds. Tetanus is a horrible way to die. Not to mention whooping cough.

    Come to that, their bullheadedness about doctors in general–you know why people hardly ever get scarlet fever, which can permanently injure a growing child’s heart or just plain kill them? Because, Mrs. Naugler, people take their kids to a doctor when they have strep throat and the doctor administers a medication that kills the bacilli before the strep throat can mature into scarlet fever. No, there is no naturopathic or homeopathic or whateverpathic substitute for this medication. None.

    (Cue Mrs. Naugler’s announcement that some rotten bread in a dish is her culturing antibiotics for the family. *eyeroll*)

  73. Sally, I like your comments, I totally believe Nicole posts the things she does to get a rise out of people. She’s all about the attention. Whether she feeds her baby onions in a pack and play is of little consequence to me.
    The important thing to me is the brainwashing of her kids in favor of the sovereign lifestyle. They will have so few choices as they age. How will they support themselves and grow into productive citizens? Will they all end up working for the dog salon? Who else will employ them without social sec. cards?
    Their supporters see non of this. Many say they want to adopt this lifestyle…..are they reading the same things I am reading?

  74. Jenny Islander, every time I read her stupid ass comments regarding her “homeopathic” treatment of her children, I become ill…..I am a survivor of polio; I spent over a year in children’s hospital, separated from my family (I was 4 when the doctor was called to our house and he realized that I had polio…our house was on quarantine, or so I’ve been told, and for the majority of the time I was on the polio ward at children’s, I was in an iron lung). As if life didn’t throw me a big enough curve ball, a several years ago, I was diagnosed with MS and as a result of the immune suppressants that I am on, I depend upon the herd to vaccinate their children so that I won’t get those diseases that N seems to think are just a part of growing up…measles, mumps, chicken pox, small pox, whooping cough, and polio. Our town is now in the middle of the beginning of a mumps epidemic because the antivaxers didn’t vaccinate their children, so I am staying inside because I didn’t get mumps when I was a child and I doubt they had the vaccine for it when I was younger…but I cannot take any of the vaccines now so people like N who think that polio, measles, mumps, whooping cough, etc. are just growing up milestones are not only putting small babies and children at risk, they are also putting folks like me at risk….BTW, polio isn’t a disease that she can check off as her kids having gotten and who are now immune….I’m immune but those months in the iron lung were not particularly a fun time nor were the braces I wore or the crutches I used for years and that one shriveled up legs isn’t a fun thing either. What the hell is wrong with those damn antivaxers?

  75. Feeding the baby in the pack n play is terrible. Worse was the blue cupcake that had to be given to the baby playing on the bare floor of the shop. No dish or table or even pack n play in sight in the video but blue cupcake on the floor. Nicole even said it was blue cupcake. WTH feeds their child on a floor of a place where animals walk around? The baby would not know enough if it hit the floor it could have who knows what on it.

    The little pieces of blue stuff on the floor in front of the toy is cupcake.

    Some one in comments mention about just cleaning the window and Nicole replied this way “Blessed Little Homestead It’s at work. Kids and dogs it’s never clean lol” Okay so if the window is never clean neither is the floor but you let your baby eat off it? Mind blowing.

    https://www.facebook.com/MyBlessedLittleHomestead/videos/1304488149563059/

  76. jeannie
    My grandmother also got polio as a kid. I can remember her telling about how sick she was and it was not anything a young child should have to go through. Also in her case at the time there was no vaccine.

    She got lucky she did not have major things wrong with her after. She was in the hospital for a long long time.

    Nicole should take the time she spends online and use it to be thanking her lucky stars that she has been so lucky with so many kids and nothing earth shattering happening to any of them yet. One can only get lucky for so long. Injuries are bad enough and usually only affect one child. It can be a whole different story with a disease that could affect all or many of them due to not getting vaccinated.

  77. My mother is one of 6 children. In the early forties 3 of those children ended up in hospital with scarlet fever. My mother had it the worst and was in a coma for several weeks. My grandparents were told that she would not survive. Her doctor, an amazing man, heard from friends in the military that they had this wonderful drug ( penicillin ) that they were using on the troops ( this was during WWII ). He drove over to the closest base, begged some antibiotics from them, and cured my mother. While it is true that 2 of the 3 children made it through scarlet fever, my family has been forever grateful that with the use of antibiotics it was 3 for 3. It was a bittersweet moment for my grandmother. She and her sister had been orphaned early due to both parents having died from “simple” infections.

  78. As far as peanuts go, they are actually used to boost the protein content of baby formula sold in several other countries ( I know India is one of them, but can’t recall the others.) My youngest ate creamy peanut butter mixed with puréed banana at six months in part because the research shows lower rates of allergy with early introduction.

    The sling video makes me a little cringe-y because it doesn’t look like she has the fabric tight enough to provide enough neck and back support to protect baby’s airway. But I wasn’t in the room with her so maybe things are tighter than they look. I will never forget posting a pic of me wearing my then three week old daughter wrapped on my back in a baby wearing group. The fact that I have been parenting for thirty years and “wearing” my babies for that long meant dick to some internet warrior mama who tried to tell me that because my daughter wasn’t wrapped in a fabric “certified” as safe by some baby wearing manufacturers group that she was in “imminent danger”. Pish tosh. While there are countless issues that I have with the way j and n “parent” I will say that I think is a culture of perceived risk around parenting that can be incredibly toxic. Would I feed my child in the pack in play, probably not. However, given the other options in that house, it may actually be the “safest” one. The range of what is considered safe for kids in 2016 vs. when I started parenting in 1985 has narrowed considerably and while I’m all for better car seats and doing better because we know better, I also think that there are many times when the shaming of parents on the basis of “safety” is less about the protection of children and more about misogyny and creating a standard of intensive mothering that achievable only by the privileged few.
    I think that nitpicking small things allows Nicole to lump all the criticism together, therefore discounting the very real dangers her children face.

  79. I think that nitpicking small things allows Nicole to lump all the criticism together, therefore discounting the very real dangers her children face.

    YES. You win the internet today. Exactly. Yes. Thank you.

  80. The nitpicking does help Nicole, and that is of course why she baits these topics so heavily. It’s easy to fall for that if you aren’t aware of her methods. Posting pictures of her kids dirty, the Christmas mud pictures, even the recent fridge raiding picture, are all are done to evoke the negativity she feeds on, imo. She works to foster the ‘poor pitiful, misunderstood and persecuted me’ image.
    However as these kids grow and try to enter a world that is foreign to them, some of these smaller issues such as poor grooming and table manners will be the first obstacles they will need to overcome. Although easier to conquer, some of these smaller issues will become very important. Being ridiculed or dismissed because you are smelly, or poorly groomed or have bad table manners will hit hard, for some. Nothing will come easy for these kids thanks to Joe and Nicole. It does help Nicole however to try to control the discussions to these smaller issues, and fog over the bigger issues. I don’t doubt that is how she copes with the sad dismal reality of her doing.
    It will be the combined effect of poor parenting, the total gamut of neglect, including many of the smaller nitpicked areas that are being posted which not only will challenge the Naugler children now but foster in the next generation of poverty and neglect if not overcome.

  81. Hoping the electrician showed up and that you are finishing painting your cabinets. I’m going to be flying to California for a quick work trip and was hoping I’d have some good reading material. 😁

  82. Just another method for those worried about food allergies is to gently rub the food your worried about inside the bottom lip and wait 30 min for a reaction. It lessens the reaction than if they were to actually consume the food. Of course listen to your dr they know you and your family better, that was just what mine told me.

  83. I wish mine had told me that! Baby no. 1 was “Peanuts bad, peanuts evil, it might be for the best to skip peanuts while you’re pregnant actually,” and baby no. 2 was, “Oh, no, all peanuts all the time honey, that’s how you avoid allergies.” From the same medical practice! AND severe allergies run in the family!

    Well, as it turns out, the only severe allergy in our kids is to something else entirely. Uyyyyy.

  84. Everything changes as drs learn more an more shoot with my oldest she slept on her side with a little baby pillow because that’s what was best then it was backs to sleep. When she had thrush horribly bad at 6 weeks the dr had her drink sugar water bottles for three days because it hurt her too bad for her to nurse. Now water will kill babies. And I’m sure after another 20 years there will be something else found out that were lucky our kids survived.

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