Compare and Contrast

Two families, with lots of things in common.

Let’s list the characteristics shared by both families.

First, lots of kids.  A whole lot of kids.

Second, color coordinated outfits.  I know they all think this looks wonderful and visually pleasing, but god damn I hate it.

Third, everyone all smiling and  happy.

Fourth, lots of comments from people about how beautiful they all are.

Follow that up with comments about how well-behaved the children are.

Here’s a very typical comment from Nicole’s page.

Fifth, both families homeschool. And both California and Kentucky require almost nothing in the way of oversight when it comes to homeschooling. The parents simply have to notify the state that they are doing so, and that’s the end of it.

There is no way to know how much education took place at the Turpin house, although they seem to have been requiring the kids to memorize large portions of the Bible.  That will prove useful in later life, I’m sure.

The Naugler kids aren’t educated in any meaningful way at all.  Nicole and Joe use the term “unschooling” but what they really mean is that they do nothing.  If the kid wants to know about something, it’s up to the kid to find out on his own.

At any rate, nobody keeps up with this. Nobody knows.  The state cannot know because they do not require anything from the parents other than a note saying “Yeah, we’re gonna homeschool. Dig you later.”

Sixth, neither family seems to have allowed the children to interact with anyone socially outside their family, or if such interaction took place, it was always with a parent present.

Seventh, both families are very much estranged from any of their extended family. No visits, no relatives living anywhere nearby, and grandparents who have never laid eyes on some of their grandchildren.

Eighth, both fathers claim to be doing what they are doing because “God” instructed them thusly.  Both of them, in other words, get their marching orders from the god in their head.

Ninth, both families try to project an image of religiosity, in one case, Protestant evangelicalism, in the other, Mormonism.

Tenth, both families deal constantly with serious financial issues.  Basically, neither one makes enough money to support their family (and “support” is a subjective word). I feel pretty confident that the Nauglers would consider themselves to be rolling in money if they had the income that the Turpins seem to have had, but financial security is very much related to spending just slightly less than you earn, and the tension is the same if the ends don’t meet, regardless of what the cash flow figures are.

Now, we’ve done a comparison.  Let’s contrast them.

How are they different?

First, Nicole and Joe plaster their entire lives all over social media. They don’t restrict it to photographs from a cheesy wedding reenactment in Las Vegas or from a trip or two to Disneyland.  Nicole invites us in for lots of stuff, and that includes videos of the children talking and playing.

This makes them way more transparent than the Turpins were.

It’s easy to see, for example, that for the most part, the Naugler children do not appear to be malnourished. None of them appear underweight.  They’re basically dirty all the time, but that’s not a crime. The younger children do not seem to have good verbal skills, but that’s just my personal observation and I am not speech therapist.

In noting this, I am taking into consideration that any views we get of the Naugler kids and/or the shitstead are all coming through Nicole’s filters. Still, it’s more than the Turpin family ever did.

Second, the Naugler children have already been in state care for several weeks, and thus have been assessed. Their CPS case is still open and hopefully will remain so for years.


Third, the oldest Naugler boy, the only one who is an adult, has an actual job unrelated to his parents (has had a series of them, in fact). We’ll see if this pattern continues, and I certainly hope it does for their sake. At least the two oldest Naugler kids are active on social media in their own voices. That’s a good thing.

So, what, if anything can we take away from the Turpin tragedy that is even slightly useful?  These, of course, are totally my own opinions, and I’m sure you all will add to them in the comment section.

First, there is a reason why some folks, including me, scream and yell that there should be more oversight with homeschooling.

It’s not that homeschooling families, by default, are doing so to hide some nefarious thing in their family.  The vast majority are not.  Child abuse occurs in all sorts of families, including those who send their children to school.

But it’s easier to hide shit if your kids aren’t in school. That is simply a fact. It’s easier to hide it if they don’t go over to Billy’s house to play.  It’s easier to hide it if the child is never, ever allowed to interact with anyone without a parent present.

Lots of homeschooling kids interact with other children and other families regularly.  If really bad stuff was going on at home, it is much more likely that somebody would notice.

The red flags go up in my mind when I see the combination of homeschooling, no interaction outside the family without parents present,  overt religiosity (especially on the part of the father), and no relatives anywhere around.

Second, photographs and videos of smiling, apparently happy children are meaningless.

You can be photographed/videotaped dancing like this and be chained to your bed and starved when you get home.

Third, appearances can be very, very deceiving, and that works both ways. Things can look bad and not be bad. They also can look good and not be good.





Transcript and Whine, Part 3

Part 1.

Part 2.

As you may recall, we broke off in mid-sentence because that was all I could take. We’ll take up right where we left off.

coming in, but I just wanted to kind of clarify some of the, um, stuff that’s going on. What’s happening to us, we are documenting it. And if it doesn’t fit in with your, you know, your nar, what you want to see in your newsfeed, then just simply unfollow the page.

But to say that this is a part of what the page is about, this is our life. And these are things that not only us have to deal with, but we’re just the ones that go public with it. Um, you know, I’m sure there’ll be comments here, I get private messages of people who’ve had similar experiences.

So if you shame somebody for talking up about what they’ve experienced, um, that’s, that’s just, again, back to the whole mommy shaming thing, there’s no reason to tear other people down. If someone says they’ve experienced something, then they experienced it.

Okay, I experienced watching Joe drink a beer in the road. Ron Sneed experienced what he describes on that video. Lisa experienced going to the door to greet a police officer who was sent there either by you, Nicole, or one of your accomplices. Al’s daughter experienced Joe trying to intimidate her. These are all our experiences.

But on that turn, don’t make stuff up to try to destroy somebody. It’s not, it’s not fair. It’s not fair to me, it’s not fair to my husband, and it’s certainly not fair to my children. They are aware of what’s going on. People say, oh, well, your kids are sheltered, you need to expose them to the world, and then say oh, your kids are exposed to too much. It’s another one of those conundrums that you just can’t ever do right.

But my children do, are exposed to this, because they are involved. You know, when CPS comes to the house because someone tells them that we don’t have heat, and they come to the house to see smoke coming out of the chimney and the woodstove just cranking away. You know, CPS documents that, and they’re like, you know, I understand this is harassment, we’re doing what we can to try to protect you guys from this harassment, but the case is still open, and we’re trying to keep things, so it’s all being documented. All of this harassment is.

But my kids are affected by it. And, you know, the snide remark about the other day when I spelled [child’s name] wrong, typed [child’s name] wrong on the Facebook page and someone made a comment about , oh, it doesn’t, don’t worry, he probably can’t read. My 14-year-old not only can read, but he actually can read comments of people that post shares from our page because that comes up on our notifications. So that was kind of just a lame thing to do.

But anyways, um, um, that’s kind of what I wanted to update on, if anybody has any questions, if you read something about us that you just think doesn’t jive right or you’re like oh my gosh, I can’t believe she did that, just feel free to ask me. I’m open and up front.

Yeah, just feel free to ask.

These are just a few recent examples of what a joy Nicole is to be around.

I have done things I’m not proud of. I’ve said things to people that I’m probably, you know, shouldn’t have said. Most of the time, they are provoked. Um, um, things I said to the blogger about her son, um, I’m sorry, it was after numerous, numerous, numerous attacks, and I lashed back with the, a very sharp tongue. And um, you know, I’m human. Not perfect. Never said I was. And that’s one of my faults.

This is, of course, not an apology. It wasn’t intended for me. This was intended for Nicole’s humpers, because even they are decent enough to know that what she has said about Nathan is beyond vile. She wants to backpedal so she’s being “humble.”

She is also lying.

I have been over all this before, but I’m going to put it all here because newbies.

My original contact with Joe and Nicole Naugler came when I saw the “viral” story of the children being taken. Please pay attention to this. Prior to May, 2015, there were no “trolls” except in Nicole’s imagination and her revised history. Nobody knew who the Nauglers  were.

I saw the story on one of the news pages and made a comment. All I said was something about agreeing that the state did the right thing. I followed that up with a few (and by few, I mean few, maybe five) comments on the various critical pages.

Joe came over to my personal Facebook page, which is open (anyone can comment, so just because somebody comments on my page, that doesn’t mean they are my Facebook friend or I know them), and began snooping around. First he “followed” me, knowing I would get a notification that he had done so. Then he started “liking” a few random pictures, knowing I’d be notified of that. He wanted me to be aware of him. And then, finally he initiated a conversation with me.

At that point (sometime in September 2015 if I’m not mistaken), I had made just a few comments on some of the various critical pages. Not many. But Joe was going to cut me off at my knees, he thought. The whole conversation is at the link I provided.

All that accomplished was to get my attention and retain my interest. Had Joe never done that, I suspect I would have forgotten they existed in a matter of a few days.

I started this blog that December, two years ago now. I did so anonymously at first, knowing that sooner or later, they would figure out who I was. I didn’t really care one way or another, but I’m glad I did it that way now, as you will see.

Almost immediately, I started getting what I call “love letters,” nasty private messages to the blog. Most of them are there. Remember that these were written when Nicole and Joe and the humpers were not sure who I was. They didn’t know for sure. They were guessing. They guessed wildly and often. I got a slew of these.

And when I went public on February 23, the day I published the “Love Letters” piece, they slowed to a crawl and then stopped.

I want to repeat that.

As soon as Nicole knew who the blogger was, the messages pretty much stopped.

I’m going to put a few of those love letters here. I know they’re all over on the other page, but a few of them are worse than the others.


Nathan suicide


These three, at least these three, were written about my son, mocking his death to me and they didn’t even know for sure I was the author of the blog. They didn’t know.

Imagine sending vile messages like that to a stranger and not being sure you have the right person at all.

That’s Nicole Naugler’s character, right there.

In March, she admitted writing at least some of them.

She absolutely, for certain, wrote this one:

Later on, that became that only one she would admit to, because her IP address gave her away, but they all smell of her.

NIcole dead junkie

nathan admission

There is one other issue here, and I want the newbies to think about it.  This blog was very new then. Nicole is wanting to pretend that there were so many people who loved them and followed them and supported them that those people would go to such lengths for them as to write horrible messages to somebody, accusing that somebody of vile things, without being sure of the identity of the person, all because they loved Nicole so much.

Occam’s Razor tells me this is just horse shit.

Nicole’s biggest defender, the person who jumps in to do battle with anyone who dares say a single word negative about her, is almost certainly Nicole herself.  She has almost no friends (and freely says so). She prefers online communication to real life interaction (and freely says that too). She is her biggest and most virulent advocate.

But you know what?  I get the whole idea that she was mad, and she wrote this awful thing, and yeah, she felt provoked, and lashed out.

And if that’s all it was, well, I’d be likely to buy it.

But that’s not all it is.

Nathan 1

Nathan 2

This, I think, is ground zero for the imaginary story Nicole has concocted about Nathan’s life and death.  It’s dated August, 2016.  She read some of what I’d blogged about and extrapolated from that.  Her opinion (and I don’t begrudge her having an opinion) is that I was a terrible parent because Nathan was being bullied and I didn’t stop it.

We did stop it as soon as we realized what was happening, but no matter.

I give her the right to have an opinion.

But she goes on to elaborate, and she does so as though what she is writing is factual.  She never says, “I think he was bullied, ” or “I think she expected too much out of him.”  She just states it as fact.

She even gets what few facts she uses entirely incorrect. For example, Nathan was thirty when he died, not 25.  I lived 4000 miles away from him, so it would have been pretty difficult for me to “feel important” when he had some success with his music.  Dave and I flew to North Carolina about twice a year for brief visits.  We spoke with Nate on the phone nearly daily, which is interesting since according to Nicole, he simply despised us.

But I could almost give her this one, too, as just lashing out because she was pissed off.


Asked what my name is, she responds by bringing up Nathan.


Ah, and it begins.  This, I think, is ground zero for the suicide thing. Suicide.  Mental abuse to the point of suicide.




This is me not giving a shit.

We noticed.


In this one, she adds to the story.

The pansy ass hubby let his wife mess with that kids head.

So Dave is now a “pansy ass” who couldn’t stop me from abusing Nathan emotionally.  Remember that.

Joe takes up the story here. He states it like it’s fact. Nathan committed suicide, he says.  Nathan did not commit suicide, but that does not stop them.

It morphs, though.

Remember?  Dave is a “pansy ass.”

Only now he’s not.  Now he’s an abusive alcoholic who was the person who abused Nathan so much that he killed himself.  I’m not guilty any more.  Dave is. I’m just feeling badly because I didn’t stand up to Dave, the abusive alcoholic.

You see, this is not about Nicole just feeling frustrated because I provoked her “numerous, numerous, numerous” times.  This is about Nicole sending me horrible messages when she wasn’t even sure who I was, mocking my son’s death when she wasn’t even certain I was the person she should be angry with, and then refusing to back down on it and fabricating a story.

This is about her making stuff up, and then Joe making up more stuff, and repeating the narrative “numerous” times until they can convince their brain-dead followers that it’s true. They have been chirping out this bogus story now for more than a year, non-stop.

The only new additions have been that somehow she has decided that I was a serial killer when I was nursing.

So, this is why her “apology” isn’t any sort of apology.

And this is why I say, “Fuck you, Nicole, and fuck you more, Joe.” This is why this blog remains and will be here as long as Nicole continues to publicly spew her nonsense.

So, um, anyways, just what I wanted to say, I need to wrap this up and I will talk to you guys later.

Thank you.


Transcript and Whine, Part 2

Part 2

Part 1 is here.

Okay, I think I’ve got this. My Facebook app didn’t like me saying “anarchist.” They think because that was something else. So I think we’ve got it going now.

Anyways, what I was saying is that I don’t think that I have to register my property with the state, whether it be my business name, my children, not that my children are property but you get the idea, um, cause things like that, I don’t think that we need to do that, but, but the system is what it is, and so I comply with the bare minimum.

Nicole uses this expression (“bare minimum”) a couple of times here and by doing so, demonstrates a basic lack of understanding of how government works. There is only the “bare minimum.” You either have registered your car or you haven’t. Your license plate is either up-to-date or it’s not. There’s no such thing as the Super Duper License Plate, unless you’re wanting a vanity plate.

Furthermore, she had an LLC. That is not the “bare minimum.” I checked, remember? I actually filled out the paperwork myself to see what was involved. The “bare minimum” is to operate as a sole proprietor. It costs nothing at all. You don’t have a register a single thing.

I wrote a piece about LLCs a while back, relating to a whole different situation, but it applies here. People create LLCs for only one purpose, to limit their liability. I thought it peculiar that Nicole went to the expense and trouble of doing that when her only real assets are connected to her business (and thus not limited). Her LLC only protected her two very used garden sheds and some white buckets from legal jeopardy if somebody sued her business.

I still think it’s peculiar.

That being said, the lack of me not registering my business name and letting it lapse wasn’t to do with any of that, it was, um, it wasn’t even me being irresponsible or blowing it off, or you know, all the rumors that people are going around that things happened. What happened was is that I completely and totally forgot that I had to do that annually. I had done it before, and last year, I had forgotten about it and got a reminder, and so it was done.

She got the reminder from one of the awful critic pages. She fails to mention that.  But there is this:

Well, this year I didn’t get the reminder. I didn’t get anything in the mail because our mail was being forwarded to the shop and I didn’t get anything, um, no notifications. My issue is, is that, well, not an issue, but my concern here what happened was is that I had been putting forwarding addresses every six months or so I would go to, um, the post office and do a change of address form. I was doing it mostly to get the Lowe’s coupons, because you get a Lowe’s coupon when you do that, but I was also doing it to make sure that my mail was continuously forwarded. And the people at the post office says well, you can no longer do this, blah, blah, blah, so I stopped. And I said well will my mail still get forwarded. Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah.

US Postal Service
One alternative.

Well, obviously, it didn’t.

So, I don’t know why, one, the post office wasn’t forwarding it, um, why they stopped letting me do the, uh, change of address forms to make sure my mail was continuously forwarded, because we still use that address. It’s not like there was a change of address and there was none, people still have our home address and so they send mail there and so that’s why I wanted to do that, and of course, I have put in a new change of address, that way anything that gets sent to our home is automatically sent to the shop.

What Nicole wants is to not pay any taxes because taxation is theft. However, she wants her mail delivered to the post office where it is addressed (the cost of this is covered by the stamp purchased by the sender), and then she wants the post office to turn around and send it to Hardin County to a different post office where it has to be resorted and delivered. This means that each piece of mail delivered costs the post office twice as much.  She wants to pay nothing for this service, forever.

Oh, and a coupon. She wants the coupon.

Dans Deals

We did this (mail forwarding) for years, because we lived in our RV and had no fixed address. It cost us about $100 per year for the service, plus postage. Our mail went to Livingston, Texas. We were legally domiciled there. We voted there, had a mailing address there, had access to a parking spot for our RV there, had Texas drivers’ licenses and Texas vehicle registration and insurance. They would receive our mail, put it in our little bin, and wait. When we got someplace for a few days, I would call for our mail to be forwarded. They would send it out the next day in a package to whatever address I gave them (often some RV park or alternatively, general delivery.) I kept a postage account with them and whenever it ran low, I’d send them some money.

That is what you have to do if you want your mail forwarded indefinitely.

Why the state didn’t send something to the actual business address, I don’t know. They don’t know why their system works that way, we talked to them yesterday but anyways, um, I never got the forms, so it completely and totally slipped my mind.

Please take note of the addresses listed there. Two places for an address, both the same.

For those that have started rumors about me not filing taxes, or sales tax or anything like that, everything on my business is on the up and up. I am completely in compliance, the bare minimum compliance, but I’m in compliance with state, local, and federal laws. So if you want to start some witch hunt on me, whatever, but you’re not going to get very far.

There are dozens and dozens of these. I cannot imagine where anybody would get the idea that Nicole and Joe might not be filing their income tax returns.

To repeat this, there is no such thing as doing the “bare minimum” when it comes to filing taxes. You either filed or you did not. You aren’t given four different IRS forms and told to choose which one you want to use. There are different forms for different situations. You either fall into one of those categories or you do not.

Nobody in their right mind pays extra. The IRS neither expects it or requires it, and in fact doesn’t want you to get creative. They want you to fill out the damned forms, correctly, and file them.

For those that are upset that I’m not paying my taxes or whatever issue you have, no, I do not pay taxes. I do not make enough income, versus [garbled] dependents to get a , to have to pay taxes. I am one of those people that get back more than you paid in or equal to or what not. It’ll probably be, the way the business is growing, I suspect, probably two more years of income before I actually have to start owing income taxes. And that’s gonna be, you know, a couple of years, granted the business grows the way that it does. So if you’re upset for some reason that I’m not paying my fair share of taxes, that’s the tax code, you can talk to your wonderful President Trump there about the changes he’s making to the tax code and so that low income families with lots of dependents no longer get those benefits. Not my thing.

But notice how Nicole produces a straw man (paying taxes) and ignores the real issue (filing taxes). Those are not the same thing. Ask President Trump, since she brought him up.

Donald Trump has a lot of money. But the only tax return we have access to says that he paid no taxes at all that year. He paid no federal taxes because he had losses that exceeded his tax liability. Those losses can be carried forward for twenty years. It’s like this (and I don’t remember his exact figures): if he lost $1 million dollars, and his tax liability was $100,000, then he could carry the excess ($900,000) forward to the next year. The next year, if his tax liability was again $100,000, he could subtract that from the carried forward balance, and the remaining $800,000 goes forward to the next year. He could continue doing that for twenty years or until the balance was zero, whichever came first. There is nothing at all illegal or immoral or nefarious or wrong with doing that. It’s just indicative, if you lost that much money, of being a shitty business person, not a successful one.

But even though Donald Trump might know that he isn’t going to owe any tax because he has these huge losses to offset them, he still has to file.

And so does Nicole.

I’ve never once thought that Nicole owed any taxes. She clearly does not. She and Joe have so many dependents that they would likely never owe any taxes until a few more of them aged out.

However, none of those dependents counts unless that child has a Social Security number. Without that, the kid might as well not exist. And Nicole does not get the option of saying, “Oh, gee, we have 10 dependents, and to owe taxes, we’d have to make $XXXXXX and we don’t make that, so we don’t have to file.”

HR Block

The only way the Nauglers don’t have to file a tax return is if they make (gross) less than about $20,000 annually. And the business is just doing wonderfully well, she says, so that can’t be the situation.

So, anyways, that’s that.

The fact, um, the other thing that was brought up was that I, um, trying to get my thoughts together, I am not sure why this group of people has become so fixated on my family to where their behavior has gotten to be to where one, that they knew that my business, um, license there had expired, and two that they actually thought it was just this grand idea to take it. That, um, like, I would understand if it was one of those companies that seizes up business names that lapse, and like, sells them for money. That would be understandable. Because that happens.

But to be such a psycho-stalker that you actually engaged in this behavior that you start a business that’s not even a business, let’s be honest here, it’s a front for a smear campaign, but, um, that’s just more proof of the psycho-stalking harassment that my family has been subjected to. Now mind you, about a month ago, or so, I posted about how they ran an auction to raise money for the Sheriff’s Association here in Kentucky. This is just a continuance of that type of behavior.

It’s interesting how Nicole does this. She turns the troll charity drive, which was basically us making fun of ourselves (the first troll doll sold was a doll mocking me), into us “rais[ing] money for the Sheriff’s Association.” The Sheriff’s Association is the parent organization of the Ranch, a camp for underprivileged children. The money didn’t go to the Association. It went to the Ranch. They are not the same thing, but she doesn’t want anyone to know that because a charity drive for underprivileged kids doesn’t work in her victim narrative.

People ask what did I do, how do I escalate this, um, I can tell you, I don’t know these people, I don’t want to know these people, I do not want to associate with anybody who has this mindset. Um, what did I do to them? Absolutely nothing.

She did nothing. Not a single thing. She never, ever called anyone’s employer trying have them fired, well, except for when she did just that. She tried to get Al fired. She tried to get her own neighbor’s butcher shop shut down purely for spite. She called and complained to the Kentucky Bar Association about Lisa. She almost certainly was behind the bogus well check on Lisa, in addition to hauling her into court over nothing. She has called several other employers, including Linda Sneed’s, for no reason at all. She accused both Linda and Al of actually convincing a local woman to try to run Quinten down in his famous chariot. And that’s just the relatively recent stuff, and that’s just a few things.

Nothing at all. Nothing.

Now, they’ll claim that I did this or that. Either one, they don’t have evidence of it and they’ve all fabricated the whole stories or two whatever I did was legitimized. For example, let’s go with the one that they commented yesterday about, um, the me calling employers. Oh, she’s calling employers. You might want to get more context into that because them saying oh she’s calling, I don’t just call up random people’s employers and harass them. What I did was, I had an issue with a local man who was using his position in his job to harass me, therefore I contacted his employer, rightly so, and that issue has been rectified. They haven’t flown over my house and no comments about my home have been posted since then. So, therefore, the issue has temporarily been resolved, hopefully permanently.

Here’s another straw man. She says, “I don’t just call up random people’s employers and harass them.” Nobody ever said she did. She calls up specific people’s employers and harasses the hell out of them. She does this purely for spite.

Even after being told repeatedly that Al couldn’t possibly have done what she claimed that he did (his flight path and altitude are not only controlled by a computer, but also recorded), she continued to insist that he be fired. As a result, the company, which transports emergency medical cases to and from hospitals, is avoiding flying over her property. However, rest assured that if the situation is one of life or death, and the Naugler property is in the flight path, those helicopters are going to fly right over there and fuck her sideways.

Here’s a comment about her “home.” It’s a shithole. It’s a mess and she’s a slob. Her children are filthy and her place is nasty.

So when they say I’m just calling up employers you might want to find out what exactly is going on.

Um, they’ve accused me of, um, calling up people’s families and sending packages to people. I hope that that wasn’t actually done to somebody because I know that I didn’t do it, I didn’t approve of anybody to do it, I think that’s a horrible thing to do and I don’t con- don’t want any part of it, so I hope that wasn’t actually done to somebody but if it was, I can assure you that was not me or anybody that I encouraged to do that to you.

Um, and making phone calls, that’s not me.

I believe the stories are fabricated, because I know I didn’t do them, and I don’t know why anybody else would do that other than to create problems for me. So when they say this person did this or this person did that, please feel free to ask me, hey, what happened with the situation, did you really call someone’s employer. In this case, I did.

Am I calling up random employers? No, certainly not.

Um, you know, they talk about the people that I have issues with, there’s a woman in Elizabethtown that I wanted to address because that’s a stalker commenting on the new business page. Um, she’s been in this group for a while. I used to be friends with this woman, my husband and I would go on double dates with this woman and her husband, um, to church activities. She is a Mormon, was a Mormon, I don’t know what she’s doing now. But, she, um, she and I, we got along, we met a few times, and you know, we moved away, lost touch, we got together one evening, had dinner, had fun, whatever, it is what it is. So now when she comes back on and says that, she started with the story that we stole, we had stolen water from her.

Um, that happened, it didn’t happen, but we were getting water from her a couple of times several years ago. Um, since then, we stopped getting water from them, we got it a couple of times, it was inconvenient location, so we only got it in, you know, those circumstances.

We talked to those people up until maybe a few months before the children were taken, we were actually communicating on Facebook. And that was after the water thing. So us getting water from them happened a while ago. What happened was, what actually happened, and why I want you to ask, when you read these things that are being said, why don’t you find out the whole story? Ask about specifics. What specific incident? Oh, she’s just had all these problems with all these people. Which people? What problems?

Because there’s always a story behind it. Like someone said, there’s always the truth, your side, their side and the truth.

This particular individual, we were friends with up until one day when her husband and my husband got into a political debate. It was a political debate. And then they unfriended us. It wasn’t back when we were supposably stealing water. It wasn’t back when we were doing whatever she claimed that we were doing. It was a few months before the kids were taken and there was a political debate. They got into an argument. Deleted. You know how that works on Facebook.

A political debate? Boy, that’s one way to spin it. The woman’s husband is a disabled veteran. Joe Naugler went on his Facebook page, with all this man’s other veteran friends, and called them all baby killers. That’s what happened.

So, for her to go on and say all of these things, it just really, it’s disturbing to me of what the motivation would be. Are you that upset about a Facebook conversation about our beliefs, about our opinions, that you would go on to accuse us of criminal activity? Um, the woman has security cameras. I swear to God she has security cameras at her house. Because she has history, and I’m not going to get into her personal stuff, but she has security cameras at her house.

Nice way to act like you’re all protecting “this woman’s” privacy and at the same time, raise all sorts of questions about her “history.” Nicole is one vile piece of shit. These people were friends of theirs. Take note of that. These people gave the Nauglers money. Not loans. Gifts of money because Nicole whined when Joe was put in jail over not paying child support.

But hey, I suppose having security cameras means that you have a “history” and it’s something nefarious.  So what’s the story about you, Nicole?

Um, we have Facebook messages, [garbled] we have all these things in a timeline that show that story’s not exactly true. But yet it’s there. And I don’t understand it. I, you know, people say, why? I have no idea. I would have to ask her and I can’t. So, I’ve asked her to come on in to talk to me and to have a conversation and to explain to me exactly what I did that would get you to say those things about me and to be involved in groups like this. Um, because I don’t understand it. And I don’t know why.

But of course, the so-called timeline does work entirely. Nobody ever said that Nicole went over there and took water. Nicole didn’t. Joe did. Joe and at least one of the older boys. The neighbors saw them and told these folks what happened. The neighbors didn’t know the Nauglers, but described Joe and the kid and the van. And Joe clearly was scrounging around getting water just before the kids were taken.

This is very like the whole Joe having a beer in the road thing. Nicole just denies it ever happened, and it doesn’t matter that several people saw it.

So, as you guys are going over and seeing these things, because they’re, they’re there, I can’t make them go away, at least not now, I want to know why people believe this and um, why, um, sorry, I was trying to make sure [garbled], but why this would even be an issue and why it’s just these people won’t stop hanging on.

They think that, um, they accuse me of things, well you have an open CPS case. I do have an open CPS case, but unless you’re one of my caseworkers, the judge, or anybody else involved in that, then you don’t actually know why my case is still open. You don’t know the specifics of it, so to assume it’s because I’m doing something wrong, or because we’re doing something wrong, or that the CPS must be a reason, it’s irresponsible to post this information as if it’s a reason to continue to harass my family.

My children are fed, they’re healthy, they’re happy, they’re educated, they are taken care of. Regardless of you, if you approve of our method of doing so, it’s still there. It’s still a fact. It still is that. Um, you can’t negate that.

I have no idea if those kids are “healthy.” How in the hell would anyone know? They don’t see doctors, so nobody really knows. And there is no way on earth anyone could know if they are happy. Just because a kid smiles in a photograph doesn’t mean he is happy. Furthermore, it’s obvious to me that they are not being educated adequately. Nicole screams that this is just my opinion, and she’s right. It is. I do not believe the Naugler children are being adequately educated. I think it’s a travesty that the state of Kentucky allows this. I understand why they do, though. I just hate it.

Um, people throwing in past things or whatever, there’s so much misinformation out there that’s being used to harass my family that it’s gotten to the point to where I have to again address it, because it is just unreal how nasty these people have gotten.

And it’s not just them posting on Facebook anymore. Like I said, it’s gone from internet trolling to psycho-stalking, and that is where I’ve always decided to draw the line. And like I was saying earlier, this isn’t just something that happens to me, um, speaking with other people, this, this behavior has gotten to be just absurd. Um, it needs to end, and they keep saying, well, she needs to end it.

Um, again, I’m not doing anything to these people. What I am doing is I’m unschooling my children. I am living off-grid at whatever means I want to, we’re not connected to electric pole, we have our own electricity, we have our own, we’re off the grid, whatever you want to debate how that works or not. We choose that.

Whether or not you like our homestead, whether you think it’s a half-ass homestead, I don’t care. It’s still our homestead and we’re still allowed to run it the way that we choose to. That is our decision. That is our home.

So when you get this idea that you can bully people into conforming to your lifestyle, and you do it to the point that you take it off the internet and you start actually trying to influence the path of someone’s life, that’s where the line has to be drawn.

I am not trying to do anything of the sort. Personally, I am just watching, sort of mesmerized and fascinated, a woman who is hell-bent on putting her entire sordid family life out in public and who does the most god-awful things and then seems to be proud of them. I also believe strongly that the state of Kentucky needs to severely tighten up control over supposed homeschooling.

There is some evidence, real evidence, that taking children from their parents, even in clear cases of neglect and even with abuse occurring, is more traumatizing and results in a poorer outcome than leaving them where they are. This is not true, of course, in cases where the child is really in danger of being killed or severely injured. However, when it comes to things like neglect (filthy kids who live in a garden shed and have no privacy, bathing facilities, are forced to use a bucket for a bathroom or probably more likely, go outside right on the ground, and are not educated), well, you have to weigh what we all see as outrageous against what might actually occur if these kids were removed. In other words, the state is damned if they do and damned if they don’t, and the kids are basically fucked regardless.

I think, frankly, this is why the CPS case is still open and the kids remain in the home. It’s the best solution they could come up with considering how many kids are involved and how little money Kentucky chooses to spend on this.

Now I’ve taken this to the county attorney, Bradley Butler knows almost all of this and he doesn’t care. Um, the sheriff doesn’t care. The judges, they probably don’t care either. We’ve only gotten that far maybe once or twice. But I’ve gone through the routes that I am legally allowed to go through. I’ve gone through the process. Whether or not someone does their job or not, I have no control over that, that is nothing I can do.

However, I can call people out on that when they don’t do it, like I did with Bradley Butler. There is an election coming up in Breckinridge County this fall. Bradley Butler is running uncontested. Nothing I can do about that. I’m not qualified to run against him and I don’t know anybody else that wants to. It’s not really a great job. So, that’s that.

The sheriff, however, he is got four or five people running against him, which leads me to say that maybe I’m not the only one who’s tired of how the county’s being run. Just my opinion, you have to ask the other people running against him why they’re running and why the people supporting them no longer think that, you know, the sheriff is doing what they want him to do. I don’t know. You have to ask them.

But what I’m saying is, is that this is starting to fall into a pattern of seeing how we’ve become a bully society, again, back to the Mommy Wars, they call them, where mom-shaming, where you know, this person didn’t do things their way, so there must not be a good mom. And there are aspects of people’s lives where you have to say, you know what, that’s really, that’s kind of pulling the line. And we’ve seen those stories. We’ve seen the stories where the police go in, they arrest the parents, they take the kids, the photographs are just horrific, it’s not a stick fence around my house that you guys try to pull from, this is like garbage and feces inside the actual homes. These are children with marks and bruises and signs of malnourishment, I mean, emotional trauma, none of which my kids ever displayed. Um, and that’s well-documented. You don’t have to believe me.

But the fact that we are almost three years into this and my children are home and we weren’t charged with any crimes and we weren’t accused of anything other than, um, dependency, which is a lame excuse of saying, well, you know, we just don’t like the way you live, because that’s all that dependency is.

For god’s sake, she is starting to cry—sometimes I just want to slam my fist into the computer screen—where in the hell are all the dogs she is supposedly grooming?

state booklet

So there you are. Abuse is an act, something you do consciously, and something you can be charged with criminally.  Neglect is also a conscious act, or rather lack of an act.  Dependency is the word they use when the situation wasn’t intentional, the parents don’t understand that it’s wrong or cannot fix it without help and the state doesn’t consider it to be their fault.  In other words, Joe and Nicole are fuck-up parents who don’t really know why they are fuckups and don’t know how to fix it.

And if you don’t know this, please, go look at other stories. Look at other things that are going on. Don’t just look at my story and say, oh, wow, that’s just kind of. . . This happens to other people. This happens to other families. Um, I’m sure you’ve all experienced this at some point in some way in your lives.

Actually, no, I haven’t.

So, we have a lot left to do with our path here, with this chapter of our trials. We’re hoping it ends soon. We don’t know, um, we don’t know, um, what’s coming up forward, in the, in the future. We don’t know how things are gonna play out. We have our game plan, we always have our game plan, and it’s usually open to, um, being quite flexible, because again you never know what, what’s gonna happen tomorrow. Um, you know, things can change at the drop of the hat.

But what I do know is that there is nothing that we have done that we feel would justify this type of behavior towards us. And I, nothing from, nothing we did justified what the sheriff’s department did to us. Nothing justified what the county did to us. Nothing justifies what CPS did to our family. Nothing justifies what the trolls, psycho-stalkers have done to our family. None of this justifies that. Um, and it has to end. And I don’t know how else to end it other than to asking people just to stop.

You know, stop doing things to try to undermine everything that we’ve worked hard for. I mean, that’s the one thing is that you’re, you’re saying you want us to be better, give better for our kids and so we bust our asses and we get stuff done and you go along and you’re just like okay, well let’s, we can’t get them any other way, so let’s go after the business.

Well, maybe you’ll stop and think, Nicole, next time before you file a bogus IPO application and cost somebody a lot of money. And maybe you’ll think twice before you either make a call to a CPS hotline or encourage somebody else to do it and try to get somebody you don’t like killed by the police. Maybe you don’t take that seriously, but the rest of us do.

That’s the most sick thing I can even, why? Why would. . .I mean, are you that petty, are you that miserable in your life that you have to just destroy everything you see? Is it, I don’t get it. I don’t. Because I’ve never done anything to these people.

I, you know, I took the woman to court because she was stalking and harassing me. I have proof , she was standing in my face in the courtroom when she followed me out when I left. Well, first of all, it’s a public courtroom, correct. But why was she there and why did she follow me out?

Because it’s the only way to exit the courtroom, you idiot. You had done so several moments before, long enough that if you had walked right out, you’d have been well outside and on your way to the parking lot. But you stopped and waited for her. It’s on the video, Nicole.

And yes, she did follow me out. There are witnesses there that I have that have contacted me that have said I saw them, I know what happened. So this is just something that is unbelievable, because the page that she ran, all of these things, coming by my home, doing all these things, contacting my, my neighbors, both of my neighbors, my home neighbor and my shop neighbor, why would this person be involved in all of that?

So when I took her to court for stalking and harassing, which I thought was a crime, um, justifiable by a protection order, Kentucky law, it wasn’t that they said that she wasn’t stalking or harassing, it’s that she didn’t pose a physical or sexual threat. The courts didn’t decide that she was innocent and that she wasn’t stalking me, what the courts said is that my argument, my evidence, did not present a physical or sexual threat, because she wasn’t physically or sexually putting me in danger, I could not get that protection order. That’s all it said.

I spoke to the county attorney, Bradley Butler, and he basically didn’t want any part of it.

Has it ever occurred to you that he doesn’t want any part of you, Nicole, because you’re full of shit and he knows it?

He doesn’t want any part of it, I’ve got him on record numerous times saying he doesn’t want any part of it. Um, there’s nothing that I can do. They, the sheriff and the county attorney tell me to contact the state police, the state police tell me it’s my county attorney’s job, they send me in circles, and I have all of this documented. It’s not a secret. Everybody knows this. Everybody has seen, heard my audios and videos to know that this is true.

So we are just left with what we have to do to protect ourselves. And um, I’ve gotta cut this short, I’ve got an appointment

THANK GOD, and I’m an atheist. Let’s leave it right there until next time. Part 3 coming up when I get it done.